Should road cars be speed limited?

[AussieAV]

Let me start by saying I'm not advocating this. My first reaction as a car enthusiast is - Hell No! Designing and engineering for speed has produced some of the most desirable, memorable and beautiful cars in history. Can't even imagine how boring cars would be if they were all designed to stay within the speed limits.

The thing is that after reading the thread about the guy doing 220 km/h in his WRX (http://www.fordforums.com.au/showthread.php?t=11309395), I thought this is probably a question that the media and/or anti-car lobbyists will be asking very soon, and this guy has given them the ammo to do so.

The scariest thing is that when I think about it, it is hard to fault the logic behind it. What are the good reasons why a road car should be capable of doing these sorts of speeds? I'm struggling to think of any so thought I'd ask everyone for some input.

Best I can come up with is that people who want to legitimately enjoy their HP cars on a track day, but can't justify/store/afford two cars, should be able to do so. But this could be covered by systems like the Nissan GTR's that can have its limiter switched on/off based on GPS location.

I don't want a nanny state, but guys like this, make it easier for those who do, to get public support.

[Grippy]

It seems to be easy enough to turn off factory Ford speed limiters with a simple custom flash tune so dont know if it will make that much difference, though the system used on Nissan's GTR is a little more complex like you said..

[|||]

ah another nanny state thread.

i'll have a swing to start us off.

hoons in fast cars are a danger to society so we should all drive speed limited cars. no one has any reason to go faster than 110kmh on a public road in a legally registered car.

[Fev]

I will never advocate this. All we need is a much stricter punishment system based on the stupidity of the driver. Blanket fines and the like don't really work. Of course they will prevent 99% of drivers from speeding etc, it's the minority who are the ones getting news attention like that moron doing 222kw in his Wrexie (bro) and they're not the ones to give a flying proverbial about what the police say or what the law says.
If it's a much more severe punishment like jailtime and hefty penalties as well as impounding/crushing THEN and only then will they think again.

[auxr]

Originally Posted by Fev

I will never advocate this. All we need is a much stricter punishment system based on the stupidity of the driver. Blanket fines and the like don't really work. Of course they will prevent 99% of drivers from speeding etc, it's the minority who are the ones getting news attention like that moron doing 222kw in his Wrexie (bro) and they're not the ones to give a flying proverbial about what the police say or what the law says.
If it's a much more severe punishment like jailtime and hefty penalties as well as impounding/crushing THEN and only then will they think again.

+1 - I can't add any more.

pps - I'll see what ACA has to say about it tonight - NOT!

[WannabeXP]

Originally Posted by Fev

I will never advocate this. All we need is a much stricter punishment system based on the stupidity of the driver. Blanket fines and the like don't really work. Of course they will prevent 99% of drivers from speeding etc, it's the minority who are the ones getting news attention like that moron doing 222kw in his Wrexie (bro) and they're not the ones to give a flying proverbial about what the police say or what the law says.
If it's a much more severe punishment like jailtime and hefty penalties as well as impounding/crushing THEN and only then will they think again.

I agree! I'm all for stronger punishment. It goes alot further then just some idiot speeding, people no longer respect the authority.
just so you know i am 20 years old! one of "them" apparently
Cheers Jason

[Fev]

Originally Posted by WannabeXP

I agree! I'm all for stronger punishment. It goes alot further then just some idiot speeding, people no longer respect the authority.
just so you know i am 20 years old! one of "them" apparently
Cheers Jason

I'm 22, so in the same boat as you.

[Romulus]

Originally Posted by Fev

I will never advocate this. All we need is a much stricter punishment system based on the stupidity of the driver. Blanket fines and the like don't really work. Of course they will prevent 99% of drivers from speeding etc, it's the minority who are the ones getting news attention like that moron doing 222kw in his Wrexie (bro) and they're not the ones to give a flying proverbial about what the police say or what the law says.
If it's a much more severe punishment like jailtime and hefty penalties as well as impounding/crushing THEN and only then will they think again.

Why? Why advocate such heavy fines penalties and fines on drivers? Vehicle impounding and crushing? Seriously? I'm yet to be convinced the justification for such heavy handed penalties are required.

There are far greater crimes committed on a daily basis that do not attract the same level of penalty as traffic infringements. Glassings, stabbings, serious assault and drug crimes often carry a less of a financial penalty than someone doing 20-30km/h over the speed limit. The folk that carry out these crimes also don't give a flying proverbial about what the police or laws say. Yet the motorists cops it in the neck. When is the last time someone charged and committed with GBH or sexual assault lost their house or all their worldly assets?

Why isn't there an anti-suicide squad in the police department or health department with the same budget as the state Traffic Enforcement Groups? After all, suicide claims far more victims that road fatalities where speed was a contributing factor!

It's my god-damn democratic right to drive my car at what ever speed I so choose. What's next, we'll all be driving hybrid Camry's?

[jpd80]

I'm no expert but speeding in a 60 kph residential zone seems to be far worse
than speeding on an open highway, anything that prevents our families form
being exposed to lunatics racing where we live is a positive.

Why not "hard lock" limit 40/50/60 kph zones to 60 kph and then unlock for all
other areas and allow drivers to use their judgment. It could be easily done
with drive by sensors or sensors embedded in the road that talk to the cars ECU.

Probably far too practical for RTAs to consider, there is the cash income to consider....

[geckoGT]

Originally Posted by GT Falcon

Why? Why advocate such heavy fines penalties and fines on drivers? Vehicle impounding and crushing? Seriously? I'm yet to be convinced the justification for such heavy handed penalties are required.

There are far greater crimes committed on a daily basis that do not attract the same level of penalty as traffic infringements. Glassings, stabbings, serious assault and drug crimes often carry a less of a financial penalty than someone doing 20-30km/h over the speed limit. The folk that carry out these crimes also don't give a flying proverbial about what the police or laws say. Yet the motorists cops it in the neck. When is the last time someone charged and committed with GBH or sexual assault lost their house or all their worldly assets?

Why isn't there an anti-suicide squad in the police department or health department with the same budget as the state Traffic Enforcement Groups? After all, suicide claims far more victims that road fatalities where speed was a contributing factor!

It's my god-damn democratic right to drive my car at what ever speed I so choose. What's next, we'll all be driving hybrid Camry's?

I see what you are saying and I will agree to the inequality of punishments between traffic offences and lower penalties for criminal offences. The way I see it though is this point is not against harsher penalties for those that commit serious traffic offences (remember we are not talking 20-30 over, the case that inspired this thread was 112 over). It is more of a point the need for an increase in penalties for the criminal offences.

The question is what is a suitable punishment, do we just jail them longer? Remember in 1788 we jailed people for years for stealing a loaf of bread, we even sent them to other lands as punishment. Did that drop the crime rate at the time, no it didn't.

That is why I am a supporter of confiscating the vehicle of serious offenders and selling it off to fund positive changes in driver education or perhaps to assist victims of road trauma. That way we are hitting the offender where it hurts, vastly reducing their ability to drive without a license and we do not have to put a roof over their heads, cover their medical and food in their mouths while we are at it. Yes that might seriously damage their life, boo hoo, they know the risk when they put the pedal to the metal.

By the way, I fixed it for you.

It's my god-damn democratic right to drive my car at what ever speed I so choose, as long as it is at or below the speed limit on public roads (unless on a track, then it is open slather)

[Mad_Aussie]

When the zombies eventually come, you won't want your car to be limited.

[AussieAV]

Originally Posted by Mad_Aussie

When the zombies eventually come, you won't want your car to be limited.

Oh, I needed that, thanks!

[grandpa_spec_F6]

Originally Posted by Mad_Aussie

When the zombies eventually come, you won't want your car to be limited.

I agree, the zombie hordes will be my primary concern also, I shall campain with the slogan "Zombies hordes will spread afar, if you speed limit my car!"

[XR6Runner]

I bet all my worth and possessions that it would never happen. Reason being, where would the Government's income come from, if nobody would get caught speeding?

[sleek7]

Originally Posted by XR6Runner

I bet all my worth and possessions that it would never happen. Reason being, where would the Government's income come from, if nobody would get caught speeding?

Just because a car is speed limited, doesn't mean there wont be speeding motorists, ppl would still do 90km/h in an 80 zone for example.

[XR6Runner]

Originally Posted by sleek7

Just because a car is speed limited, doesn't mean there wont be speeding motorists, ppl would still do 90km/h in an 80 zone for example.

Sorry, thought the OP meant GPS based speed limitation. As in, you are driving in an 80 zone, so you are limited to 80.

[tweeked]

NO NO NO NO

A strong, law abiding society comes from a willingness to follow fair laws, not limiting freedom to ensure that you have no choice.

I would not wish to live in a place where you are forced to comply. We fought wars to save ourselves from living that way.

[Mad_Aussie]

Not even 2% (two percent) of road fatalities are caused through travel above set speed limits. The vast majority of fatalities therefore occur through "below the limit speeding" yet there is no safety initiative where 98% of fatalities occur.

http://www.roadsense.com.au/facts.html



Also, AussieAV, you're welcome

[bungarra]

[QUOTE=Mad_Aussie]http://www.roadsense.com.au/facts.htmlQUOTE]

Have requested per capita data from the WA Office of Road Safety of vehicles on roads vs number of speed related deaths for 1970-1979 and the corresponding data for 2000-2009. I was told by one of the staffers that it was to hard to reconcile the data and do a comparison as all studies would have to take in changes to vehicle standards, laws etc.

When I pressed further, I was told that the figures based on per capita, showed less people killed from accidents involving speed in the 1970's.

I can understand agencies like the ORS wanting higher fines and lower speed limits when most of their income is derived by them.

[flappist]

Well Australia is a signatory to several treaties and I suspect one of them has to do with limiting speed.

Or did you think that the 250km/h limit on FPV/HSV/BMW/Merc/Audi/whatever was just a coincidence....

P.S. yes I know there are a few above 250km/h models but that number occurs FAR too often...

[Mad_Aussie]

Originally Posted by flappist

Well Australia is a signatory to several treaties and I suspect one of them has to do with limiting speed.

Or did you think that the 250km/h limit on FPV/HSV/BMW/Merc/Audi/whatever was just a coincidence....

P.S. yes I know there are a few above 250km/h models but that number occurs FAR too often...

I was under the impression it was more of a gentleman's agreement, much like the Japanese all limiting their power output to 206kw...

Got a link with info? I'd like to read about this... Not at all saying that I don't believe it, I just wasn't aware of it.

[GYRKIN GT]

Speed limiters on cars/bikes? No way! Never, ever!

However, in saying that, I imagine anyone with even half an interest in performance vehicles would suffer palpitations each time he/she reads about some lunatic exceeding the speed limit by ridiculous amounts.

The scary part for the responsible performance vehicle enthusiast is the unfortunate link, in the majority of cases, of ridiculous speed and vehicle type. That is, huge speed and performance vehicle normally go hand in hand.

The reality is the figure of 222km/h in a 100 zone is quite irrelevant. Why? Because 170 km/h in a 100 zone would be equally as dangerous! Once a vehicle is travelling at those speeds it becomes academic. Therefore, something like a Toyota Yaris, capable of doing 170km/h, is equally a weapon. But, typically, you don't find morons in mum's Yaris doing 170km/h in a 100 zone. It always comes back to the type of car and that's the problem.

How do you stop the problem? No easy answer is there. I believe the absolute majority of performance car people behave (most of the time) very responsibly. For those morons out there who can't behave themselves then-
(1) Go to gaol and not for a Hilton etc sentence, For speeds like we've been talking about, I mean gaol for 12 months minimum;
(2) Car is forfeited, no matter who owns it, and it's crushed;
(3) For those huge speeds, sorry, never allowed to drive again;
(4) Caught driving again, even without involving speed, 5 years picking up soap again and the car is crushed (no matter who owns it)

I suppose where I'm coming from is that I become slightly irritated when I hear about some moron doing 222km/h is his WRX and, because of that moron, some Prius lover will very likely suggest putting a speed limiter on MY GT!! Stuff the moron.

[tweeked]

Originally Posted by GYRKIN GT

How do you stop the problem? (4) Caught driving again, even without involving speed, 5 years picking up soap again and the car is crushed (no matter who owns it)

Even your GT?

[GYRKIN GT]

Originally Posted by tweeked

Even your GT?

HaHa, Very good.

Shall I bite? Ah, no thanks.

[flappist]

Originally Posted by GYRKIN GT

Speed limiters on cars/bikes? No way! Never, ever!

However, in saying that, I imagine anyone with even half an interest in performance vehicles would suffer palpitations each time he/she reads about some lunatic exceeding the speed limit by ridiculous amounts.

The scary part for the responsible performance vehicle enthusiast is the unfortunate link, in the majority of cases, of ridiculous speed and vehicle type. That is, huge speed and performance vehicle normally go hand in hand.

The reality is the figure of 222km/h in a 100 zone is quite irrelevant. Why? Because 170 km/h in a 100 zone would be equally as dangerous! Once a vehicle is travelling at those speeds it becomes academic. Therefore, something like a Toyota Yaris, capable of doing 170km/h, is equally a weapon. But, typically, you don't find morons in mum's Yaris doing 170km/h in a 100 zone. It always comes back to the type of car and that's the problem.

How do you stop the problem? No easy answer is there. I believe the absolute majority of performance car people behave (most of the time) very responsibly. For those morons out there who can't behave themselves then-
(1) Go to gaol and not for a Hilton etc sentence, For speeds like we've been talking about, I mean gaol for 12 months minimum;
(2) Car is forfeited, no matter who owns it, and it's crushed;
(3) For those huge speeds, sorry, never allowed to drive again;
(4) Caught driving again, even without involving speed, 5 years picking up soap again and the car is crushed (no matter who owns it)

I suppose where I'm coming from is that I become slightly irritated when I hear about some moron doing 222km/h is his WRX and, because of that moron, some Prius lover will very likely suggest putting a speed limiter on MY GT!! Stuff the moron.

Only problem with this is......

What is the penalty for killing the police chasing you?
5 years in slot may as well be 15 years and if you kill the police you may get away........

In USA the penalty for rape was made the same as murder (execution).
All that happened was a huge increase in rape/murders as opposed to rape where the victim survived.
The rape penalty was lowered and the number of rape survivors increased.
But the total number of rapes (inc murders) did not vary all that much.

You have to be careful as not everyone has the same regard for human life or society and if you have nothing to lose you have nothing to care about.

P.S. can you tell me where your GT is so I can "borrow" it and have it crushed just for a bit of fun......does it still not matter who owns it.....

[GYRKIN GT]

Originally Posted by flappist

Only problem with this is......

What is the penalty for killing the police chasing you?
5 years in slot may as well be 15 years and if you kill the police you may get away........

In USA the penalty for rape was made the same as murder (execution).
All that happened was a huge increase in rape/murders as opposed to rape where the victim survived.
The rape penalty was lowered and the number of rape survivors increased.
But the total number of rapes (inc murders) did not vary all that much.

You have to be careful as not everyone has the same regard for human life or society and if you have nothing to lose you have nothing to care about.

P.S. can you tell me where your GT is so I can "borrow" it and have it crushed just for a bit of fun......does it still not matter who owns it.....

Flappist, I hear you.

Therein lies the problem. There is no easy solution. Everyone will have a different reality as far as a solution is concerned. So, how the hell are the legislators suppose to deal with it?

PS, you wouldn't really drive my GT on a public road in the State of New South Wales at those speeds, would you?

[zdcol71]

Originally Posted by GYRKIN GT

Speed limiters on cars/bikes? No way! Never, ever!

However, in saying that, I imagine anyone with even half an interest in performance vehicles would suffer palpitations each time he/she reads about some lunatic exceeding the speed limit by ridiculous amounts.

The scary part for the responsible performance vehicle enthusiast is the unfortunate link, in the majority of cases, of ridiculous speed and vehicle type. That is, huge speed and performance vehicle normally go hand in hand.

The reality is the figure of 222km/h in a 100 zone is quite irrelevant. Why? Because 170 km/h in a 100 zone would be equally as dangerous! Once a vehicle is travelling at those speeds it becomes academic. Therefore, something like a Toyota Yaris, capable of doing 170km/h, is equally a weapon. But, typically, you don't find morons in mum's Yaris doing 170km/h in a 100 zone. It always comes back to the type of car and that's the problem.

How do you stop the problem? No easy answer is there. I believe the absolute majority of performance car people behave (most of the time) very responsibly. For those morons out there who can't behave themselves then-
(1) Go to gaol and not for a Hilton etc sentence, For speeds like we've been talking about, I mean gaol for 12 months minimum;
(2) Car is forfeited, no matter who owns it, and it's crushed;
(3) For those huge speeds, sorry, never allowed to drive again;
(4) Caught driving again, even without involving speed, 5 years picking up soap again and the car is crushed (no matter who owns it)

I suppose where I'm coming from is that I become slightly irritated when I hear about some moron doing 222km/h is his WRX and, because of that moron, some Prius lover will very likely suggest putting a speed limiter on MY GT!! Stuff the moron.

Here's an anecdotal story ( the type that I detest so much but will use as I have not the patience nor calmness of temperment to quantify by taking a proper survey).
I have had a 5 way,traffic lighted intersection built right outside my front door (spare you the details and angst around that), but where there was once a sedate tree lined roundabout ,there are now five christmas trees,funnelling up to 10 lanes of traffic into 5 everytime the lights turn green.
I can tell everyone here with no fear of retribution that there are no morons driving mums Prius that see this chage of light as an invitation to post a PB before 2 lanes merge into 1 100m up the road. I can also safely say it's not some old pants ****in' geriatric either. You know who it inevitably is?? surprise surprise ..it's the "performance car enthusiast". You name it, any pedigree of gt (or otherwise) falcon, fpv's, hsv's, wrexies, gtr's, brand affiliation is not an issue. Everytime I hear the burn out and screaming of tortured engines racing away from the lights, my mind drifts to implants,(or as a close substitute,electric collars), the type that you would put on a testosterone fuelled ,aggresive dog! Everytime the hormones take over, push the button!! I take my dog(a highly charged,intact, staffordshire) to the park(read track) to let him unwind. If he carried on in public(read public roads) like he does there, I would have to freakin shoot him!!!
I have a V8, have driven them before as well, heck, I even owned an XT GT, but lets ask the question,"why is it that so many "performance car enthusiasts" are the ones we keep reading about in these and similar threads??

[data_mine]

Originally Posted by zdcol71

Here's an anecdotal story ( the type that I detest so much but will use as I have not the patience nor calmness of temperment to quantify by taking a proper survey).
I have had a 5 way,traffic lighted intersection built right outside my front door (spare you the details and angst around that), but where there was once a sedate tree lined roundabout ,there are now five christmas trees,funnelling up to 10 lanes of traffic into 5 everytime the lights turn green.
I can tell everyone here with no fear of retribution that there are no morons driving mums Prius that see this chage of light as an invitation to post a PB before 2 lanes merge into 1 100m up the road. I can also safely say it's not some old pants ****in' geriatric either. You know who it inevitably is?? surprise surprise ..it's the "performance car enthusiast". You name it, any pedigree of gt (or otherwise) falcon, fpv's, hsv's, wrexies, gtr's, brand affiliation is not an issue. Everytime I hear the burn out and screaming of tortured engines racing away from the lights, my mind drifts to implants,(or as a close substitute,electric collars), the type that you would put on a testosterone fuelled ,aggresive dog! Everytime the hormones take over, push the button!! I take my dog(a highly charged,intact, staffordshire) to the park(read track) to let him unwind. If he carried on in public(read public roads) like he does there, I would have to freakin shoot him!!!
I have a V8, have driven them before as well, heck, I even owned an XT GT, but lets ask the question,"why is it that so many "performance car enthusiasts" are the ones we keep reading about in these and similar threads??

I have to disagree with you there (should've taken that statistically relevant survey :P)

The problem isn't the enthusiasts, it's the idiots that think having a performance car pulls the chicks, or inflates their pant region.

And those people come in all varieties (age, sex, race, etc.) and cars. My GT-P is currently off the road, so instead of being lined up by HSVs, and any ******* VL, my rental Getz is getting lined up by any tard in a 4 banger econobox.

[XR6TCraig]

Originally Posted by zdcol71

Here's an anecdotal story ( the type that I detest so much but will use as I have not the patience nor calmness of temperment to quantify by taking a proper survey).
I have had a 5 way,traffic lighted intersection built right outside my front door (spare you the details and angst around that), but where there was once a sedate tree lined roundabout ,there are now five christmas trees,funnelling up to 10 lanes of traffic into 5 everytime the lights turn green.
I can tell everyone here with no fear of retribution that there are no morons driving mums Prius that see this chage of light as an invitation to post a PB before 2 lanes merge into 1 100m up the road. I can also safely say it's not some old pants ****in' geriatric either. You know who it inevitably is?? surprise surprise ..it's the "performance car enthusiast". You name it, any pedigree of gt (or otherwise) falcon, fpv's, hsv's, wrexies, gtr's, brand affiliation is not an issue. Everytime I hear the burn out and screaming of tortured engines racing away from the lights, my mind drifts to implants,(or as a close substitute,electric collars), the type that you would put on a testosterone fuelled ,aggresive dog! Everytime the hormones take over, push the button!! I take my dog(a highly charged,intact, staffordshire) to the park(read track) to let him unwind. If he carried on in public(read public roads) like he does there, I would have to freakin shoot him!!!
I have a V8, have driven them before as well, heck, I even owned an XT GT, but lets ask the question,"why is it that so many "performance car enthusiasts" are the ones we keep reading about in these and similar threads??

Fair call. I see the same thing all the time, as do many others here I am sure.
Here is a question for you. What if the nearest park ( read track) to take your intact Staffy ( read performance car) was 100klm, or 1000klm away? Would you still own a dog? As an animal lover I am sure you would. Just that you would have to let him have his fun a little more discreetly!

While car entuisiasts should keep this kind of thing off the roads, there are parts of Aus where tracks to unleash the beast simply don't exist. Qld with its vast distances is a pretty good example of this. Want to run your performance car/sportsbike around a track? Great in Brissy or the Sunny/Gold coasts. Kinda hard in Cairns, Townsville, Mackay though, as you are at 12-20 hours drive from a track where track days are held.

Now look at Vic and it is the opposite. This state is literally littered with tracks in close proximity. Live in Melbourne and you have access to 4 or 5 within a 200klm radiu.s 99% of the population probably lives within 3 hours of a track, so there really is no excuse to let out some steam in the right place, providing that access is available via a track day company, etc. All that needs to be done here is ensure that the penalties for anti social behaviour are strict enough to encourage everyone to go to a track day instead.

Part of the solution ( one of many that need to be implemented) may just be to providing more parks for you to walk your dog in and let him have a little freedom. Its only a small part of the solution, but one that should be considered. After all, we build skate parks in every town to keep kids amused so that they don't indulge in anti social behaviour. What are we doing for the revheads as a society?

[Cooper69S]

i don't agree with the suggestion. what would you set it to? 100? 110? 130? what if the 130 limit in NT gets removed? what about emergencies where people might need to temporarily exceed the speed limit? also there are many countries where cars that are also sold here can legally do any speed they like. plus there are plenty of 'off road' places where people might legally want to go faster.
one system that I see merit in is a GPS controlled limiter with an override option that I saw discussed on TV a while ago. In order to exceed the limit you'd need to override the system which would report the override request with some central monitoring mob and you'd have to justify your reason for speeding (eg emergency of some sort). I reckon something like that could possibly be made to work... (conspiracy theories aside)

Originally Posted by GYRKIN GT

(2) Car is forfeited, no matter who owns it, and it's crushed;


I suppose where I'm coming from is that I become slightly irritated when I hear about some moron doing 222km/h is his WRX and, because of that moron, some Prius lover will very likely suggest putting a speed limiter on MY GT!! Stuff the moron.

2 things...
1) I'm sick of reading people call for car crushing... raises my pulse every time I read it somewhere. There is one reason and one reason only (IMO) to crush a car and that is if it is worthless like the crusty old galant they crushed over here recently. otherwise crushing is a complete waste, sell it instead and do something useful with the money. even unroadworthy cars can be worth decent money as a track car. Hypothetically, if I commited some stupid act a coupla times and my car was crushed instead of sold, If I'd been planning on buying my old one back then I'd have to change my plans and buy another one just like it instead - what has crushing then achieved? nothing. All the crushing idea does is pander to the pitchfork weilding lynch mob out baying for blood. it's ridiculous. I haven't heard of any valuable cars being crushed either so it seems that the law enforces have more sense in that regard than many keyboard warriors.

2) we have laws and penalties for exceeding the speed limit pretty much ever since we've had cars. there's no real need for this bloke to be national news. I don't know that bit of road, but being on a freeway at 1am there's a fair chance that he was at less risk of doing any damage than I was when I did 200kmh in a wrx at Barbagallo raceway with other cars in front and behind me. I'm not trying to justify his actions, just that the media sensationalises this stuff way too much. people have always sped in cars, police have usually caught them eventually, and in these circumstances he'd always have lost his licence for longer than any car impound period (who cares if the car is impounded if you have no licence anyway ).