Autonomous cars &a your thoughts?

[FPV0002]

Evening all, been a lot of buzz surrounding autonomous/self driving cars these last few weeks and their arrival in the not too distant future. I have heard some 'futurist' describing a scenario in which we will no longer need to own a vehicle one day and we will simply command one to come when we need it, take us to our destination and then bugger off and pick someone else up. I would like to hear other car enthusiasts thoughts on the self driving car and what the motring landscape will look like once they are mainstream. I personally love driving and with the exception of the odd slow boring commute in traffic to work would prefer to steer myself. Getting your pride and joy out on a nice day and taking it for a cruise is one of life's pleasures that I always look forward to. I cannot imagine there would be a love for an autonomous vehicle as it would simply be an appliance? I am also a tradesman so in need a vehicle everywhere I go to carry all my gear. What are everyone's thoughts?

[solarite_guy]

Agree. Not interested.

[Sprint XR8]

Self-driving Taxis Will Become the Most Disgusting Spaces on Earth

With the entire automotive industry looking toward a future of driverless mobility, commercially owned self-driving taxis seem poised to be on the frontline of tomorrow. However, nobody seemed to realize that these vehicles will eventually become little more than mobile toilets.

Animals are universally disgusting and humans are no exception. While we’ve mastered land, air, and sea, consider the spaces we occupy while we traverse those expanses. Rental cars are returned filled with candy wrappers, spilt soda, and human hair. Uber vehicles are routinely vomited in. The subway is a haven for disease. Airplane interiors experience havoc within the first hour of a flight as the worst of us begin defecating into the seats, too lazy and weak to control ourselves.

Autonomous taxis aren’t likely to endure better treatment. Without a driver present, the urge to have drunken sex will be far too strong — and those odds only increase when you add a second occupant to the equation. With nobody watching, we’ll leave half-consumed hamburgers and cans of sweetened tea on their floors that will roll around and turn the carpet into a sticky magnet for larger pieces of garbage.

Bloomberg speculates the never-ending process of cleaning other people’s filth will cost large firms with autonomous fleets tens of millions of dollars annually. That number swells into the billions when you account for insurance, maintenance, storage, and the accelerated devaluation of such vehicles.

Uber is desperate to make the switch to driverless vehicles as soon as technology allows it, but abandoning the vehicle’s owner could result in unforeseen costs. Since drivers are responsible for their own cars, Uber’s policy is to force passengers who make a mess to foot the cleaning bill. This often results in drivers paying it themselves, especially when there isn’t a standout vomiting incident allowing for easy finger pointing. However, even when there is, it’s notoriously difficult to actually force someone to pay and often times not worth pursuing.

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/201...aces-on-earth/

[Squalo]

My question is "Who asked for driverless cars?"

When we find that person, we put them in a driverless space rocket and fulfill all their desires.

[Guzz226]

Just wait until the Government realises they will loose millions in revenue from speed cameras....surely there is an autonomous car tax in the wings.

[jpblue1000]

Originally Posted by Guzz226

Just wait until the Government realises they will loose millions in revenue from speed cameras....surely there is an autonomous car tax in the wings.

Governments wont need the amount of tax currently as there will be much less road trauma, roads wont be torn to shreds by overweight vehicles and self directed hoons, less environmental damage to clean up, the economy will do better with more productive time spent not in traffic, no local manufacturers to support.
Win win win for the taxpayer. It wont happen overnight but it will happen.

JP

[Guzz226]

Originally Posted by jpblue1000

Governments wont need the amount of tax currently as there will be much less road trauma, roads wont be torn to shreds by overweight vehicles and self directed hoons, less environmental damage to clean up, the economy will do better with more productive time spent not in traffic, no local manufacturers to support.
Win win win for the taxpayer. It wont happen overnight but it will happen.

JP

Less trauma...hopefully. There is a long way to go before we get to that...it is very easy to trick an automonous car into thinking a stop sign is a 130kmh limit - just takes one rogue individual and some stickers.

I don't share your optimism that GovCo will survive without a major revenue stream though.

Throw in battery cars with less fuel excise and I can see an autonomous tax and an electricity levy given the electrical system is already stretched.

[eb2fairmont]

Originally Posted by jpblue1000

Governments wont need the amount of tax currently as there will be much less road trauma, roads wont be torn to shreds by overweight vehicles and self directed hoons, less environmental damage to clean up, the economy will do better with more productive time spent not in traffic, no local manufacturers to support.
Win win win for the taxpayer. It wont happen overnight but it will happen.

JP

It's an awesome scenario. You won't need as many cars as you just lease for the time you need the car. Less road trauma so you don't need as many doctors and nurses, police, ambos or fireies to get people out of car or care for them.

Less physios too.

And autonomous trucking there's a few more jobs not needed.

These guys pay tax. They may not need as much in terms out outgoings but the tax base is about to shrink markedly due to automation.

There will be new jobs to fit in with this but not the sort of jobs which people without a trade or degree will actually get.

To be honest there could be massive social upheaval coming and that doesn't bode well for a nice stable society.

I'm for autonomy and robots when it helps productivity not when it puts people out of jobs.

[Ben73]

Originally Posted by eb2fairmont

There will be new jobs to fit in with this but not the sort of jobs which people without a trade or degree will actually get.

Once driver-less vehicles are normal, that's hundreds of millions of people out of a job world wide. There is not going to be hundreds of millions of jobs for "autonomous vehicle programmer" or "autonomous vehicle maintainer"
Bring on the new industries that don't exist yet, because we need them before there is an unemployment crisis.

Originally Posted by eb2fairmont

It's an awesome scenario. You won't need as many cars as you just lease for the time you need the car. Less road trauma so you don't need as many doctors and nurses, police, ambos or fireies to get people out of car or care for them.

How will there be less cars? Sure less cars in private hands, but there will be theoretically more cars on the road. Once I'm finished driving for the day my car stays inside my garage, if my lift home was just a driver-less taxi once it drops me off it will be back out on the road hunting for the next passenger. So not only will you have all the regular commuters, but you will also have the empty cars driving around heading to the next job.
But since the unemployment rate will be like 40% with many jobs automated, no one will have jobs to travel to or have any money to travel around or spend on leisure activities. So yes there will be less cars on the road I guess.

Originally Posted by GTMOND

I'm so over the whole technology crap, not just cars, but the replacing humans with computer operated equipment.
They just keep coming up with this Sh.t to replace blue collar jobs, so it will be the select few fat cats who become wealthy and everyone else struggles ,because of our desire to replace our base jobs with technology.

Business tax rate will be 70% because they will have to help support the millions in centrelink lines.


On the plus side once self driving cars are among regular traffic I hope they are easy to identify from a distance. I will need to know so I can push in front of them at merge lanes. The computer will err on the side of caution and let you merge to avoid a crash, plus I won't feel bad cutting off a computer.

[mr smith]

There will never be vehicles zipping around with no driver or more importantly no one responsible for the vehicle. To say they wont have accidents is BS, how many times has software and hardware failed?
In the 1950s there were going to be flying cars in the future...where did that go.

[XB GS 351 Coupe]

Originally Posted by mr smith

There will never be vehicles zipping around with no driver or more importantly no one responsible for the vehicle.

Hate to tell you they already are, not just cars zipping but massive trucks travelling driverless on public roads delivering freight.

http://intellibus.rac.com.au/?gclid=...RoCVYYQAvD_BwE


https://www.cnbc.com/2016/10/25/driv...ing-truck.html

[mr smith]

Originally Posted by XB GS 351 Coupe

Hate to tell you they already are, not just cars zipping but massive trucks travelling driverless on public roads delivering freight.

http://intellibus.rac.com.au/?gclid=...RoCVYYQAvD_BwE


https://www.cnbc.com/2016/10/25/driv...ing-truck.html

Not some remotely controlled or monitored vehicle with a team of engineers sitting behind PCs.
I am talking totally stand alone and relying on its own systems and able to navigate all scenarios.

Never going to happen.

[Terror_Tree]

If the car can drop me at the pub, and pick me up when I have had a skinfull I might be interested then

[roddy1960]

Originally Posted by Terror_Tree

If the car can drop me at the pub, and pick me up when I have had a skinfull I might be interested then

G'day , Our pollies will have fun with that one..Methinks that autonomous or not the law makers will have a cow deciding if the owner is 'legally' in charge of the driver less chariot if he or she has had a skin full. Probably not dis-similar to being pulled by a car with pretty lights containing the boys and girls in blue and they find the young bloke on his L 2's obeying every road rule known to man with the old boy tanked to the eyeballs in the passenger seat being driven home to face the music from the missus. "You're still booked sunshine "
It'd probably need a new rule or two adopted to cover that sort of situation even for autonomous cars.
I wonder will taxi companies go this way one day too .
Cheers Rod..

[XRtowcar]

It's the end of the world. Aargh.
Was wondering if car companies will even need to sell the vehicles they build as they could just run a taxi business as less people will need to own a car.
Just request a car in an app and wait a few minutes and your off.

[CyberWasp]

'Without a driver present, the urge to have drunken sex will be far too strong — and those odds only increase when you add a second occupant to the equation'

Are a lot of people going to be having sex with themselves in these autonomous cars??????

[cheap]

If autonomous is the way of the future we may end up being transported in drab cardboard boxes. If motoring heads the was of the PC there is next to no difference between an Lenovo, Dell or Toshiba. Crack open a PC and they're basically the same cheap computer bits inside.

Welcome to the brave new world of visionary motoring Kim Jong iL style. Good luck with any vehicle modifications, the manufacturers will probably have proprietary everything including wheel nuts.

[lra]

A Tony Mouse car may be feasible in Euro countries where public transport is everywhere, and a drive of more than 100k will result in you falling off the edge of whatever country you are in.
When one can drive you from the Sydney Harbour Bridge to Cameron Corner without getting lost, hitting the local fauna, or loosing its suspension in a bottomless pothole, I will say 'OK, they have succeeded', but not in my lifetime.
I think cars will run out of fuel, be it petrol, gas, lithium batteries, flux capacitors, whatever before Tony Mouse cars are mainstream.

[b0son]

Goodbye trucking industry....

[Crazy Dazz]

There's a lot of chatter about autonomous Taxis (or Uber) and I just can't see how it works.
For starters, most countries don't have high labour costs like Australia.
Then, what happens when your auto-uber rocks up and the last passenger has vomited allover the interior?
It would also seem like a cheap way for people to nick parts.

And whilst I'm not about to say "it will never happen" I don't see how you get around the legal issues surrounding liability. (Especially in a country like the USA where suing big corporations is their national sport.)

I can see greater levels of autonomy working for your own car. As long as you are in the drivers seat, you are deemed to be in control, and held liable. And there would be some attraction, especially for daily commuting in traffic.

The other thing that worries me, in all seriousness (and without going all "iRobot") is the question of children and roos. I have collided with a roo twice, both times on my way home in suburbia, so it is a real issue.
If I am driving along, and I see a roo or child by the side of the road, I know to slow right down because bother are unpredictable and prone to stupidity. How do you teach that to a computer? If you program it to detect pedestrians on the verge and slow down every time, you'll never get anywhere.
How do you program it to recognize that the vehicle stopped is full of school children?
And lastly, if god forbid a child does run in front of me, I will swerve and do anything possible to avoid them, even if that means going off the road. A roo? No chance, thats what roo bars are for. Even if you could program a computer to know the difference, Will the vegan brigade insist all cars are programmed to protect wildlife?

[BENT_8]

Meet George Jetson...

[eb2fairmont]

Originally Posted by Crazy Dazz

There's a lot of chatter about autonomous Taxis (or Uber) and I just can't see how it works.
For starters, most countries don't have high labour costs like Australia.
Then, what happens when your auto-uber rocks up and the last passenger has vomited allover the interior?
It would also seem like a cheap way for people to nick parts.

And whilst I'm not about to say "it will never happen" I don't see how you get around the legal issues surrounding liability. (Especially in a country like the USA where suing big corporations is their national sport.)

I can see greater levels of autonomy working for your own car. As long as you are in the drivers seat, you are deemed to be in control, and held liable. And there would be some attraction, especially for daily commuting in traffic.

The other thing that worries me, in all seriousness (and without going all "iRobot") is the question of children and roos. I have collided with a roo twice, both times on my way home in suburbia, so it is a real issue.
If I am driving along, and I see a roo or child by the side of the road, I know to slow right down because bother are unpredictable and prone to stupidity. How do you teach that to a computer? If you program it to detect pedestrians on the verge and slow down every time, you'll never get anywhere.
How do you program it to recognize that the vehicle stopped is full of school children?
And lastly, if god forbid a child does run in front of me, I will swerve and do anything possible to avoid them, even if that means going off the road. A roo? No chance, thats what roo bars are for. Even if you could program a computer to know the difference, Will the vegan brigade insist all cars are programmed to protect wildlife?

Those autonomous trucks in the pilbara can do just that. If something wanders into its lane it will panic stop if it's within a certain distance. They also predict oncoming traffic interactions and slow up if it deems it a risk to coming into its path.

They will even stop if a tumbleweed less than a foot in diameter gets into their path.

Are they better than a manned truck. No. Do they move more than a manned truck? Yes just cos they don't need to take a **** or change shifts.

Do they work well on long hauls yup but in tight spots they suck.

[Crazy Dazz]

Originally Posted by eb2fairmont

Those autonomous trucks in the pilbara can do just that. If something wanders into its lane it will panic stop if it's within a certain distance. They also predict oncoming traffic interactions and slow up if it deems it a risk to coming into its path.

They will even stop if a tumbleweed less than a foot in diameter gets into their path.

Are they better than a manned truck. No. Do they move more than a manned truck? Yes just cos they don't need to take a **** or change shifts.

Do they work well on long hauls yup but in tight spots they suck.

There are however a number of important distinctions.

1. Since year dot, haulpaks have always had right of way on minesites, and so other traffic behaves accordingly. Collisions are already (thankfullly) few and far bewteen.
2. They operate on circuits, so there are no complex interactions.
3. A human driving a haul truck can't see ****, so electronic "eyes" would actually be a huge improvement.
4. They already cost millions to buy, maintain, and operate, so even say an extra $100k for the autopilot, is chump change.
5. Drivers are paid a LOT of money to sit on their **** and try not to fall asleep. To employ, feed, and accomodate a driver on a remote site probably costs a company $300k per year. How many uber drivers make that kind of money?
6. By definition they are hauling rocks. If the autopilot (or collision avoidance) sends a truck off a bench, its a simple insurance claim. If a bus does the same thing, your company is going down for billions in compensation and somebody is going to be charged with reckless homicide.
7. If it runs over a Mallee Fowl, nobody but the resident tree-huggers cares.

[Rallye Sport]

I'm watching the RAC auto bus trial in South Perth with interest.

Almost twelve months and it still crawls at 15kph, freaks out and stops if a cyclist goes by or a bird gets too close.

Then theres pedestrians or drivers like me that like to tease it.

The palms and trees on the road side had to be butchered so as not too interfere with it but they're growing back now causing head aches.

It can't negotiate roadworks either so tough titties for the roadworkers who need to cone off areas whilst working, they're told to pack up and get out of the way.

They're talking about taking it out on a main, dual lane road near a freeway ramp soon, good luck with that one...

[GTMOND]

I'm so over the whole technology crap, not just cars, but the replacing humans with computer operated equipment.
They just keep coming up with this Sh.t to replace blue collar jobs, so it will be the select few fat cats who become wealthy and everyone else struggles ,because of our desire to replace our base jobs with technology.
I'm sorry, but science and technology design and manufacturing , can only employ so many people. Plus like it or not, not everyone is capable of being a A grade student.
Supermarket self checkouts I avoid just purely on principle as this could well have been one of my kids after school jobs, convenient yes but only real benefit is the supermarkets bottom line.
Anyway back to autonomous cars, well it's pretty clear how I feel.
Science and technology certainly have a place, but not at the cost of the average Joe trying to get a job.

[Franco Cozzo]

Can't get phone reception out 50km from Melbourne and you think they're going to have driverless cars any time soon

I can't wait to rub one out in a driverless taxi, and then when I'm out of there you're going to sit in the same place

[Nanoraptor]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

Can't get phone reception out 50km from Melbourne and you think they're going to have driverless cars any time soon

I can't wait to rub one out in a driverless taxi, and then when I'm out of there you're going to sit in the same place

oh. ew. Bet you're not the only one though

Bet you're on camera too and the taxi operator sells the pics on the internet for a little more profit. Never underestimate people.

Interesting times. Be great if folk who truly love driving for the sake of driving get to keep our V8 meditation time. Our unpredictability relative to tens of thousands of automated vehicles may be the noise in the system that helps stop the unintended consequences of so many pieces of code controlling identical vehicles reacting identically...

Imagine a whole country full of automated cars zipping along highways two seconds apart at precisely 100.000km/h and something truly unexpected happens like a small asteroid (as over Chelyabinsk in 2013) and every car is blinded (or even completely confused by the EMP from the burst) for 2-3 seconds.

Unintended consequences in too-rigid systems and boom, the chain reaction could have tens of thousands of fatal crashes across a state in under a minute.

Of course, good programming would have that noise integrated into every vehicle. Vehicles might even have slightly different driving personalities, and while I might trust coders as a group to *think* of all those potential issues and their fixes I don't trust corporations to actually allow individdual ones time to *implement* them well.

We drivers might just save everyone, and nobody would know.

*wishful thinking*

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by Nanoraptor

oh. ew. Bet you're not the only one though

Bet you're on camera too and the taxi operator sells the pics on the internet for a little more profit. Never underestimate people.

#faketaxi

[radler]

Fable has a time of the humble horse and cart...

No carbon tax back then, but people could easily step on things in the dark .... sort of like dog crap, but on a larger scale .... and things were measured in 'horse power' .... or as some prefer 'chasing ponies...

But on a serious note ... electric driverless cars .. has the potential to change world economics with less reliance on middle easten oil ...

[Ben73]

Good for brain dead idiots that would rather look at Facebook 8 hours a day rather than drive, but I'd prefer to drive myself 90% of the time.