No V8 option from Ford in 2010.... - Page 4

vztrt · 22-06-2009, 12:00 PM

Nothing wrong with the GM power plant, but are Holden gonna be able to get it Euro 4 compliant?

4Vman · 22-06-2009, 12:17 PM

Even GM, the "Jurassic park" of engine companies are going to OHV V8's into the future....

JPFS1 · 22-06-2009, 12:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vztrt

Nothing wrong with the GM power plant, but are Holden gonna be able to get it Euro 4 compliant?

I think they'll be ok with Euro4. I have heard they have VVT and DI available on their pushrod architecture.

nugget378 · 22-06-2009, 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joshvee

Holden is still using push rods in their V8s???

: I didn't know that.

Why the weirdo icon?
their V8 is superior to the Ford product IMO pushrods or not, and if I was buying a V8 now I would without hesitation buy the holden..

Wally · 22-06-2009, 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vztrt

Nothing wrong with the GM power plant, but are Holden gonna be able to get it Euro 4 compliant?

Good question.

I guess they always have the Northstar SC 4.4 DOHC up their sleeves if push comes to shove. They are Bin8/Euro4 compliant aren't they?

Wally · 22-06-2009, 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nugget378

Why the weirdo icon?
their V8 is superior to the Ford product IMO pushrods or not, and if I was buying a V8 now I would without hesitation buy the holden..

Be careful with those comments, you'll end up being accused of being a Holden sympathyser. LOL

vztrt · 22-06-2009, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wally

Good question.

I guess they always have the Northstar SC 4.4 DOHC up their sleeves if push comes to shove. They are Bin8/Euro4 compliant aren't they?

I've had a look and cant see but they're still in production so I'll assume so.
The supercharged version would go alright in HSV.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wally

Be careful with those comments, you'll end up being accused of being a Holden sympathyser. LOL

Or start a pointless argument thats been done to death.

crYnOid · 22-06-2009, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JPFS1

I think they'll be ok with Euro4. I have heard they have VVT and DI available on their pushrod architecture.

VVT is available on the current Gen4 engine.
DI is coming with the Gen5 motor which has been delayed until GM gets itself sorted. Expect GM to drop capacity with the introduction of DI to keep power/torque levels about the same. I.E. Gen4 = 6L, Gen5 = 5L

Northstar is dead. OHC on a LSx block tho....

JPFS1 · 22-06-2009, 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crYnOid

OHC on a LSx block tho....

I've heard about some proto's running about in the last couple of years... thought it was pretty reliable info, might be some truth to it afterall.

burnz · 22-06-2009, 03:27 PM

small block chev's had the option for ohc in the 80's (bowtie aftermarket)
A.F.M. was released in april this year (genIV 6.0L) only.

Wally · 22-06-2009, 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crYnOid

VVT is available on the current Gen4 engine.
DI is coming with the Gen5 motor which has been delayed until GM gets itself sorted. Expect GM to drop capacity with the introduction of DI to keep power/torque levels about the same. I.E. Gen4 = 6L, Gen5 = 5L

Northstar is dead. OHC on a LSx block tho....

When did the LC3 die?

Scrawny · 22-06-2009, 03:44 PM

I've always thought that if there had been a turbo charged 6 cylinder XE & XF running around in Group A, Ford sales today would be a different story.

It was still a "win on Sunday, sell on Monday" climate back then & if Ford had a car that you could actually buy in Oz going around & occasionally winning , rather than the Sierra, there wouldn't have been a whole generation lost to Holden & their performance sedans.

Nikked · 22-06-2009, 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

Even GM, the "Jurassic park" of engine companies are going to OHV V8's into the future....

They alreaddy have in the past, the Lt5 was an awesome package, its just a shame they didn't stick with it.

I can only assume that the Northstar will die with Buick and pontiac...unless the use it in some othe GM products. The supercharged Lc3 puts out 330kw...

Its a bit annoying the compaines relied on racing so much, the FE 427 Cammer was canned because NASCAR banned it. So ford didn't have any need to kep on building it. It would of had an interesting effect if put into production...we may not have needed to wait to the 90's for a ford V8 cammer...

XR Martin · 22-06-2009, 08:53 PM

I dont get this obsession with OHV big V8s.
The LSX is smaller, lighter, more powerful, cheaper and more efficient than the equivalent Ford V8.
Realise that the 500hp LS7 engine is lighter, cheaper, more torquey, shorter, narrower than the 500hp BMW v10. Put the LS7 in the M5 and it would be a quicker car, so what exactly is the problem with the fact it has a cam in block?

Hp/L doesnt mean anything in reality (other than for morons to circle jerk over), its total hp/torque and cost thats important

And then theres the fact that any Joe can buy and build themselves a 500hp LSx engine without being an oil baron. Same cant be said for any 500hp Euro N/A engine...

Falc'man · 22-06-2009, 09:32 PM

Guys, my 2020 comments were tongue-in-cheek. I meant to say 2040

Quote:

Originally Posted by XR6 Martin

I dont get this obsession with OHV big V8s.
The LSX is smaller, lighter, more powerful, cheaper and more efficient than the equivalent Ford V8.
Realise that the 500hp LS7 engine is lighter, cheaper, more torquey, shorter, narrower than the 500hp BMW v10. Put the LS7 in the M5 and it would be a quicker car, so what exactly is the problem with the fact it has a cam in block?

Hp/L doesnt mean anything in reality (other than for morons to circle jerk over), its total hp/torque and cost thats important

And then theres the fact that any Joe can buy and build themselves a 500hp LSx engine without being an oil baron. Same cant be said for any 500hp Euro N/A engine...

Fwiw I agree with this post with respects to the LSx motors. Kilowatts per kg of engine there aren't many that come close. Refinement, however, could be improved on. If they can get the refinement right, as well increasing the "all important" specific power then all the power to them.

crYnOid, I thought it was a 5.3L, not a 5.0L they're bringing in? Apparently it's only a matter of timing for GM to introduce it... VF is due in a few months... it may make it's debut there?

geckoGT · 22-06-2009, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

Even GM, the "Jurassic park" of engine companies are going to OHV V8's into the future....

Quote:

Originally Posted by XR6 Martin

I dont get this obsession with OHV big V8s.
.

If I may be a bit picky, Holden have had a OHV engine for as long as they have had a V8, the 307 that was released in the HK was OHV. OHC is another story, they still do not have OHC V8.

OHV= overhead valve
OHC= overhead cam

OZQUAD44 · 22-06-2009, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by geckoGT

If I may be a bit picky, Holden have had a OHV engine for as long as they have had a V8, the 307 that was released in the HK was OHV. OHC is another story, they still do not have OHC V8.

OHV= overhead valve
OHC= overhead cam

Thanks for picking that up Gecko. It was annoying me, Like nails down a chalk board.

Overhead Cam people! or more to the point DOHC, Double Over Head Cam ah la ford Boss.

Both Chev and Ford motors have overhead valves. Side valve motors are a thing of the past, Ie 40's and 50's past.

Unless of course 4V was referring to something else? Over Head Vortex, or Oarsome High Velocity, or somthing else?????

burnz · 22-06-2009, 10:18 PM

it's all the same, dont forget 2/3/4 valve ohv are pushrod.
ohc can allso be 2/3/4 valve.

nugget378 · 22-06-2009, 10:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OZQUAD44

Thanks for picking that up Gecko. It was annoying me, Like nails down a chalk board.

Overhead Cam people! or more to the point DOHC, Double Over Head Cam ah la ford Boss.

Both Chev and Ford motors have overhead valves. Side valve motors are a thing of the past, Ie 40's and 50's past.

Unless of course 4V was referring to something else? Over Head Vortex, or Oarsome High Velocity, or somthing else?????

It was an obvious typo, very easy being the C is next to the v.

That's how I read it anyway,Im sure 4vman knows very well the difference between the two..

4Vman · 22-06-2009, 10:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nugget378

It was an obvious typo, very easy being the C is next to the v.

That's how I read it anyway,Im sure 4vman knows very well the difference between the two..

Correct!

OZQUAD44 · 22-06-2009, 10:25 PM

I know he does......

What didn't you like, Oarsome High Velocity :-) ????

EgoFalcon · 22-06-2009, 10:26 PM

Classic sales technique, say there not making anymore so you buy one now, he is lieing there are gonna be ford v8's avaiable next year, salesman mate, cant trust them, they need a sale! lol

XR Martin · 22-06-2009, 10:48 PM

Sorry, when I posted "I dont get this obsession with OHV big V8s" I was meant to say "I dont get this obsession against OHV big V8s"

DanielXR8 · 23-06-2009, 08:24 AM

galaxy xr8, that salesman you spoke to, must be devastated at the front cover of the latest Wheels magazine. I guess a new GT-HO wouldn't be a V8 according to him.

Dan

GT69 · 23-06-2009, 10:40 AM

Or another angle on this. What if the majority of V8 buyers are aware of the new V8 next year and decide to hold off....There may not be a new Ford V8 if sales of XR's drop completely because of speculation.

It wasn't in his best interest to talk about the new engine and how promising it is. With incremental power increases, even with the BOSS, You would still have to say the BOSS XR in 2010 will have the GT engine (or atleast guess at that) So 290 to 315 right there......The more people who know all these little bits and pieces, the less likely they are to run in and buy an XR8 RIGHT now.

This person sells stuff for a living, he has to make his living (and income for his dealership) between now and July 2010 when the new V8 will be here, Why would he say anything other than 'whatever' to get a sale now? Makes sense to me.....I panic bought an XR6T because there was talking of the I6 leaving us new year........

crYnOid · 23-06-2009, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Falc'man

crYnOid, I thought it was a 5.3L, not a 5.0L they're bringing in? Apparently it's only a matter of timing for GM to introduce it... VF is due in a few months... it may make it's debut there?

I used 5L as an example of where GenV could go :P it could be anything from 4.9L to 5.7L on the 'base' engine.

As for GenV intro, not for a few years.

R-Design · 23-06-2009, 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GT69

Or another angle on this. What if the majority of V8 buyers are aware of the new V8 next year and decide to hold off....There may not be a new Ford V8 if sales of XR's drop completely because of speculation.

You'd think Ford would be used to consumers acting this way. If anything it'd make Ford more likely to rush it to market.

I think there'd be a few people on the Forums who wouldn't mind this strategy. Personally, I don't think I can take another 12 months of speculation.

BigAL_250 · 23-06-2009, 05:36 PM

I reckon this dealer guy should read the new edition of Wheels, doesn't exactly follow his story.

HO 3 · 23-06-2009, 05:51 PM

IMO wether or not a V8 survives in FPVs line up next year the GT needs to be reinstated as the premium model in its line up. Like it or not currently the sharpest tool in Fords tool box performance and handling wise by a fare margin is the F6.... with heavy discounting on the V8 GT models to keep there sales moving. Some will say im bias because I own a FG F6 and not the current GT, but either way I do believe FPV need to change its approach for both models to survive in the future. :evil3:

Cheers Mick

geckoGT · 23-06-2009, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GT69

It wasn't in his best interest to talk about the new engine and how promising it is. With incremental power increases, even with the BOSS, You would still have to say the BOSS XR in 2010 will have the GT engine (or atleast guess at that) So 290 to 315 right there......The more people who know all these little bits and pieces, the less likely they are to run in and buy an XR8 RIGHT now.

.

Unfortunately, as nice as the idea is it will not happen as the 315 will not comply with the new emissions regs.

As for the OHC/OHV thing, I was having a dig and that is why I said I was being picky.