RANT - Old people on our roads

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by russellw

We had a look at this data a few months back in the Tech thread HERE where it was clear that a couple of age groups (including the elderly) were disproportionately represented in the fatalities.

However, it is probably better to look at this data based on the actual population spread in our population and thus the data looks like the charts below for the calendar year 2007.

The first is the mean fatality rate for drivers by gender - that is to say it represents the number of people in each age group for each fatality - thus a higher number is better than a low one.



The next is the same data set for passengers:



an the last is for the combined data:



We can thus quickly surmise the following:

1. The risk to male drivers is still highest in the 17-25 age group with the next highest risk being the 70+ although it is still 40% lower than the former.

2. A similar pattern is apparent for female drivers (albeit at lower rates) with the 70+ still being the second highest risk but still 30% lower than the 17-25 age group. Indeed the risk at that higher age is very close to that in the 26-39 age group.

3. Passenger fatalaties tell a different story - the highest risks are still at the 17-25 age group but the difference between genders is much closer regardless of age group and in the 70+ bracket they are both very high with the feamle rate actually being worse.

Cheers
Russ

Thanks for that Russ..

Ok so to all the grandparents out there DONT ride with the grandkids!!!

But on a serious note.. im sure all the rabid defenders of the 17-25 yo bracket will find some way to discredit the stats....

[eb_5litre]

So what the hell happens when people turn 70 !! lol

[eb_5litre]

I wouldnt even try to defend the 17-25 bracket.... IMO their accidents are caused by carelessness and stupidity, the elderly I believe would be caused by decline in awareness and alertness.

I wonder what the stats would look like if it took into account the CAUSE of accidents and not just those involved?

[Rodp]

Originally Posted by russellw

We can thus quickly surmise the following:

1. The risk to male drivers is still highest in the 17-25 age group with the next highest risk being the 70+ although it is still 40% lower than the former.

2. A similar pattern is apparent for female drivers (albeit at lower rates) with the 70+ still being the second highest risk but still 30% lower than the 17-25 age group. Indeed the risk at that higher age is very close to that in the 26-39 age group.

3. Passenger fatalaties tell a different story - the highest risks are still at the 17-25 age group but the difference between genders is much closer regardless of age group and in the 70+ bracket they are both very high with the feamle rate actually being worse.

Also bear in mind that your average 70+ driver/passenger's body isn't going to react the same way a 17-25's body when it comes to trauma in an accident. It'd take a lot less trauma to cause a fatality in a 70+ year old.

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by eb_5litre

So what the hell happens when people turn 70 !! lol

They start to revert back to the same driving ability they had when they were 17-25.....

[Silver Ghia]

Originally Posted by 4Vman

They start to revert back to the same driving ability they had when they were 17-25.....

I just thought, I've only got 17 years to go. Does that mean I'll be going around my favourite corner again correcting with opposite lock, as I did when I was 18? LOL.

Only hope my abilities are still good then, as I can't think not being able to drive my toys.

I hope eb_5litre and others think of themselves also in 40 or so years time. The years do come around quickly. Sure, if the reflexes and co-ordination isnt there, they probably should call it a day, but knowing a number of people who are around 70, I would think 70 is still a bit too young for that to happen for most people.

I also find people (including myself) tend to drive faster these days, they're in a real hurry to go where they're going, mostly going well over the speed limit and accelerating quicker also as the cars are more powerful. So everything is relative when you say the oldies are slower drivers especially when they're driving their 1980's cars.

[Full Noise]

There’s a common misconception that just because someone’s been driving for X number of years, that they are good at it. You only have to watch BS commercials for Australian Pensioners Insurance “you’ve been driving for forty years and you’re an experienced driver” so you should be getting a better deal on your car insurance.

Driving is an acquired skill, sadly there are many who fail to realise this.
I know people who have been driving for over forty years and are still crap at it, yet they’ll claim that because they haven’t had an accident in X number of years, they’re good drivers. FFS tell that to all of the people who have been involved in accidents trying to avoid these people.

If the "powers that be" added up the amount of hours that the elderly actually drive to the percentage of accidents that they are involved in, the numbers would probably be off the scale.

Every three years I have to renew my dangerous goods licence. This involves a dangerous goods refresher course, medical and demerit point printout. If I fail on any of these, or have too many points up, no DG ticket.

Drivers over 70 should “at the very least” have to show their competency to drive in a practical test. There would be some who would still pass the medical and the theory, yet still be bloody hopeless out on the road.

[Silver Ghia]

Originally Posted by Full Noise

There’s a common misconception that just because someone’s been driving for X number of years, that they are good at it. You only have to watch BS commercials for Australian Pensioners Insurance “you’ve been driving for forty years and you’re an experienced driver” so you should be getting a better deal on your car insurance.

Driving is an acquired skill, sadly there are many who fail to realise this.
I know people who have been driving for over forty years and are still crap at it, yet they’ll claim that because they haven’t had an accident in X number of years, they’re good drivers. FFS tell that to all of the people who have been involved in accidents trying to avoid these people.

If the "powers that be" added up the amount of hours that the elderly actually drive to the percentage of accidents that they are involved in, the numbers would probably be off the scale.

I think that should include weekend drivers who dont really do much driving, and it is quite apparent by the way they drive, some are pretty hopeless also. Also as I said in my previous post, I say 70 is still too young. Perhaps 80?

Or alternatively have everyone do a 5 yearly test and be done with it, also to ensure changes to road rules etc are known to everyone.

[eb_5litre]

In 40 years time i'll be 72 and probably flying a hover car.... so does that mean i'll have to follow the pilots license procedures for testing? lol

[Full Noise]

Originally Posted by eb_5litre

In 40 years time i'll be 72 and probably flying a hover car.... so does that mean i'll have to follow the pilots license procedures for testing? lol

You plan on living another 40 years? I don’t, so I can’t help you with that one.

[aussiblue]

It would be nice to get a further break down of the 70+ stats i.e the same 19 year interval as for the other groups that is the 70 to 89 and 90 to 109 to see how/if it changes.

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by aussiblue

It would be nice to get a further break down of the 70+ stats i.e the same 19 year interval as for the other groups that is the 70 to 89 and 90 to 109 to see how/if it changes.

Not sure what the point of that is, its obvious that there is a continual diminishing level of driving competency from age 70 onwards...

[Fev]

I have actually been hit in parking lots and such by ONLY pensioners. and im so angry about it next time it happens im sending the bill to the RTA becaue they are the ones who should be enforcing other peoples saftey on our roads and because i have seen sooo many bad drivers who are 90% of the time over the age of 65 i think mandatory drivers tests at 65, 70 then on to 72, 74, 76 and then once a year after that. small price to pay for the saftey of other people

also. people living some geographical locations should be tested more. St Ives has the worst drivers in Sydney.

[4Vman]

Ive managed to drive in carparks for 22 years without incident let alone being attacked by these alleged rabid erratic driving pensioners.... in fact large vans and the urban 4WD are more of a carpark menace imo due to their size and poor visibility, and ive managed to navigate them too...

[xtremerus]

I think that ALL drivers should re-sit the driving test every 10 yrs, as the road rules are constantly changing, and that way drivers are up to date with the rules.
Some road rage is probably caused by the lack of knowledge of the current rules.

[ST]

I really cannot see how a lot of you object to ideas like these, the suggestion is simply driving tests for older drivers. If they are great drivers as you all say they are, then why object to this poll? A test will only prove their skills.

There should be no objections to a test (logically there shouldn't), we all know there are plenty of seniors who don't belong on the road and plenty who do. A test will enforce this; make the roads a safer place by removing the poor drivers and make the better elderly drivers feel more confident in their driving.

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by RTSW

I really cannot see how a lot of you object to ideas like these, the suggestion is simply driving tests for older drivers. If they are great drivers as you all say they are, then why object to this poll? A test will only prove their skills.

There should be no objections to a test (logically there shouldn't), we all know there are plenty of seniors who don't belong on the road and plenty who do. A test will enforce this; make the roads a safer place by removing the poor drivers and make the better elderly drivers feel more confident in their driving.

There's far more evidence to suggest the need for annual IQ or "driver attitude and maturity" tests for 17-25 yo's too... but i cant see that ever getting the go either.

[ST]

This isn't a thread comparing elderly and young drivers, it's a thread about the dangers of elderly drivers and possible solutions. Make a similar thread about younger drivers if you wish to talk about that. But please stop constantly rebutting everything with a "younger people are worse..." argument.

[aussiblue]

This isn't a thread comparing elderly and young drivers.....

The opening line of the opening post of this thread would suggest otherwise; vis:

It is widely documented that P platers are a major trouble on our roads, .....

[Auslandau]

Originally Posted by RTSW

This isn't a thread comparing elderly and young drivers, it's a thread about the dangers of elderly drivers and possible solutions. Make a similar thread about younger drivers if you wish to talk about that. But please stop constantly rebutting everything with a "younger people are worse..." argument.

Sorry but you cannot have a "pick on the oldies" thread without making comparisons. If a thread is started with a "pick on the P platers" there would be lynchings from all the 'P's on how good they can drive ........ If you didnt want a discussion with differing views, there would be pages of sheep and how boring and false that would be!



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[eb_5litre]

Interesting poll stats........

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by auslandau

Sorry but you cannot have a "pick on the oldies" thread without making comparisons. If a thread is started with a "pick on the P platers" there would be lynchings from all the 'P's on how good they can drive ........ If you didnt want a discussion with differing views, there would be pages of sheep and how boring and false that would be!

That's correct, you can't have discussion with opinion without something as a reference point or "measurement" if you will: (better than, equal to, worse than etc...), otherwise it would be just an "agreement" thread....

[JG66ME]

Originally Posted by eb_5litre

Interesting poll stats........

Print them of and frame them. On your 69th birthday you can take them along with you when you hand in your license.

I hope by then you live in a house on your own and there is no one to go pick up your shopping or take you to the doctors. By then there will be no pension to take care of you. In your dog eat dog world no room for compasion. Soylent Green for your generation.

[eb_5litre]

Originally Posted by JG66ME

Print them of and frame them. On your 69th birthday you can take them along with you when you hand in your license.

I hope by then you live in a house on your own and there is no one to go pick up your shopping or take you to the doctors. By then there will be no pension to take care of you. In your dog eat dog world no room for compasion. Soylent Green for your generation.

You want some vinegar with that chip?

[Bobman]

Why do old people always drive with their sun visors down, even if it's cloudy or raining?

Something to counter the "they were young once too" argument, is that back in those days the cars were different, traffic patterns were very different, as was society.

We live in a fast paced society these days and sadly the old folk can get confused and disorientated easily. Probably safer to take a bus. Older folk can be rude and impatient as well. I do however respect my elders.

[Auslandau]

Originally Posted by Bobman

Something to counter the "they were young once too" argument, is that back in those days the cars were different, traffic patterns were very different, as was society.

We live in a fast pace society and sadly the old folk can get confused and disorientated easily. Probably safer to take a bus.

You are joking here I take it?



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[Bobman]

Originally Posted by auslandau

You are joking here I take it?

See me laughing?

[Auslandau]

Originally Posted by Bobman

See me laughing?

Well you would have to be as no one could say that with a straight face .........



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[flappist]

Originally Posted by Bobman

Why do old people always drive with their sun visors down, even if it's cloudy or raining?

Something to counter the "they were young once too" argument, is that back in those days the cars were different, traffic patterns were very different, as was society.

We live in a fast paced society these days and sadly the old folk can get confused and disorientated easily. Probably safer to take a bus. Older folk can be rude and impatient as well. I do however respect my elders.

Yes when we just got our licences we didn't have SMS, ipods, the internet, constant violence and society was very different.

No kids were bankrupt because their high speed interelect could not understand the concept of interest and repayments.
If you saw a school kid on a train carrying a military rifle, you complemented them of their patriotism not rang 000 and peed yourself.
There were no speed cameras, and if fact many places had no speed limits, we didnt need them as most people were intelligent enough to know when to go fast and when to go slow. There was not a hoon problem with the constant doof doof in the background, when we raced we went out into woop woop because we did not want to annoy others.
We had to work and save up for what ever we wanted and a credit card was something that was a reward from the banks for many years of credible and intelligent operation of banking facilities not a crab pot for catching dumb children.

We thought that by employing technology to assist our lives we would improve society as a whole and in some ways it has worked but THERE WAS ONE HUGE PROBLEM.

We have inadvertantly created a whole generation of self centred, arrogant, impudent, ignorant, financially naive, insular children who truly believe that because they are allowed to use the technology THAT WE INVENTED aquired with money THAT WE GAVE THEM they are some how superior to us.

So shut down your computer that we invented, disconnect your interenet that we invented, and drive your car that we designed on the roads that we built to somewhere where YOU CAN DO SOMETHING TO IMPROVE THE WORLD INSTEAD OF JUST COMPLAINING ABOUT US AND BLAMING US FOR YOUR PROBLEMS.

[vanman_75]

you live in hervey bay eh ,you would know more than most. how much has that place changed in 25 years , stupid traffic lights for all these younger people that are in such a hurry ,they couldnt work out a roundabout ,the older people are not slow ,mostly. its just that everyone is just so damn fast .