should police stop high speed chases

blkvt8 · 23-03-2010, 12:39 AM

in the light of recent events should the police stop trying to pull over highly speeding drivers .....
also should the police be blamed for other peoples actions ... like mmmm maby some scum bag stealing a car, killing a famly and him self and nealy his girlfriend

snappy · 23-03-2010, 12:46 AM

How it is now is ok , chase them down back off in built up area's or when it reaches excessive speeds .

Yellow_Festiva · 23-03-2010, 12:47 AM

1) Police should continue high speed chases following all the procedures and protocols that are in place already.

2) A police officer should not be held to blame if the chase has a bad outcome as long as they followed the procedures and protocols mentioned in point 1.

Yellow_Festiva · 23-03-2010, 12:48 AM

As above.

Rodp · 23-03-2010, 01:08 AM

Confused.

Poll: should police be involved in high speed chases

Subject: should police stop high speed chases

Contradict each other - this poll is meaningless.

pottery beige · 23-03-2010, 07:55 AM

Dont chase them.. Shoot the bastard's..

Jim Goose · 23-03-2010, 08:07 AM

Oppps.... how on earth can i retract my vote?!?!?!?!??!!

**DJR-351** · 23-03-2010, 08:19 AM

It defiantly needs reviewing.....

To say this is the only way is wrong, with that attitude we would all still be living in caves.....

And no I don’t blame the police, they are constrained by procedures, and it’s this that needs reviewing.....

10 dead in Qld alone as a result of these situations is more than enough writing on the wall for me.....

geckoGT · 23-03-2010, 08:29 AM

Yes there may be a requirement for better methods of apprehending dangerous drivers such as helicopter etc, but the simple fact is the police need to be able to chase and apprehend these dangerous fools.

By the way, the difference between the thread title and the poll questions is a bit confusing. Also polls get better results if the original post is not so heavily biased.

UNR8D · 23-03-2010, 08:31 AM

no CHASE them, people are trained to be AWARE on the roads, the problem is that no one is, and NO I'm not placing the blame on family's killed in light of recent events the fault of that lies DIRECTLY with the moron waste of oxygen who decided to steel the car in the first place, but if people were more aware of what is going on around them and stopped following the bonnet of their car and thinking everything was ok then we would have less crashes full stop, one thing I got taught a while back was regardless of 'right or wrong' you cant argue that point if your dead...

the issue of the crashes lies squarely in the hands of the one breaking the law in the first place, DONT try and blame the cops for that, can you imagine how they felt when they turned up to the scene? the problem with asking this question on a forum or in the papers is that you have armchair bandits who have NEVER been in that situation nor would have the balls to do the job of the officers involved, so in turn have NO right to comment.

rant off.

pottery beige · 23-03-2010, 08:35 AM

Take them out with RPG's..

Mickxr8 · 23-03-2010, 08:35 AM

i`m with "pottery beige" on this one.

DBourne · 23-03-2010, 08:36 AM

If they don't chase people then what insentive is there to stop?

Yes what happened is a tragidy, and yes with better resources they probably could of had a chopper follow the car rather than the HWP vehicle.

Gotta love how there is 1 incident and people get all ruffled up and think the world needs to change.

**DJR-351** · 23-03-2010, 08:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UNR8D

no CHASE them, people are trained to be AWARE on the roads, the problem is that no one is, and NO I'm not placing the blame on family's killed in light of recent events the fault of that lies DIRECTLY with the moron waste of oxygen who decided to steel the car in the first place, but if people were more aware of what is going on around them and stopped following the bonnet of their car and thinking everything was ok then we would have less crashes full stop, one thing I got taught a while back was regardless of 'right or wrong' you cant argue that point if your dead...

the issue of the crashes lies squarely in the hands of the one breaking the law in the first place, DONT try and blame the cops for that, can you imagine how they felt when they turned up to the scene? the problem with asking this question on a forum or in the papers is that you have armchair bandits who have NEVER been in that situation nor would have the balls to do the job of the officers involved, so in turn have NO right to comment.

rant off.

Hey sunshine, EVERY road user has a right to comment.....Grow up!!!

**DJR-351** · 23-03-2010, 08:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SgtBourne

If they don't chase people then what insentive is there to stop?

Yes what happened is a tragidy, and yes with better resources they probably could of had a chopper follow the car rather than the HWP vehicle.

Gotta love how there is 1 incident and people get all ruffled up and think the world needs to change.

1 incident...??? do you have the memory of a goldfish or something...???

pottery beige · 23-03-2010, 08:45 AM

Police need a fully stacked Blackhawk.. POP.. GAME OVER!!..

JK EX CHASER · 23-03-2010, 08:50 AM

The penalty for thief's is not heavy enough, they get a slap on the hand for thieving cars.the government need to step in.

calais · 23-03-2010, 08:54 AM

I personally believe that there are times where a quick apprehension of a criminal is required, however the use of Highway Patrol cars to simply chase (ie; not immobilise) the offender is a surefire ticket to tragedy as recent incidents have proven.

The American Highway Patrols and Service Police all use aggressive tactics to end any chase as quickly as possible. The Australian Police do not. I am speaking of 'Pitt' maneuvers and spike strips, and lastly actually shooting at the driver and vehicle to end the pursuit. From what I understand, the levels of escalation for the use of additional force can be climbed very quickly for the Americans, Not so for the Australian Police.

If the Police went out in force with these very aggressive tactics right from the detection of the crime, criminals MAY be less likely to engage in a high speed getaway, and the resulting 'chase', may not be necessary.

Fear and apprehension might just be enough of a deterrent if the consequences are severe enough.

UNR8D · 23-03-2010, 09:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJR-351

Hey sunshine, EVERY road user has a right to comment.....Grow up!!!

ill leave the stressed face wrinkles and saggy....... for you ;)

what I meant was everyone has their 2c regardless of weather they know what they are talking about or not, how is that even helpful?... would you let grade 10's make changes to how a surgeon performs his work because they think the risk of dieing during an operation is too high?....

**DJR-351** · 23-03-2010, 09:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UNR8D

ill leave the stressed face wrinkles and saggy....... for you ;)

what I meant was everyone has their 2c regardless of weather they know what they are talking about or not, how is that even helpful?... would you let grade 10's make changes to how a surgeon performs his work because they think the risk of dieing during an operation is too high?....

No i would'nt, point taken.....glad we got that cleared up....

**Burnout** · 23-03-2010, 09:41 AM

Queensland Police stopped pursuits in February this year. The Qld Coroner found Police responsible for the deaths of a number of people in pursuits & recommended prosecutions, so the Police Union advised members not to pursue offenders.
Interestingly the Attorney General, Police Minister, Police Commissioner & Premier had nothing to say on the matter.

I assume this means extended joy rides for offenders.

merlin · 23-03-2010, 09:44 AM

I think the whole world has gone soft - I was watching the 7pm Project last night - their highly soft opinions were

1) speed limit cars to 110km/h so this would have never happened (George Negus the genius who admitted drink driving last week came up with this one)
2) provide education to the offenders so they won't do it again.

Education? PLEEEASSE, scum bag had a record longer than the Harbor Bridge but when he had his coma 10 months ago, we should have all held his hand and "educated" him. I am not joking. I would have given him a bullet to the head at the cost of 50 cents and saved the tax payers some money.

Why do we allow innocent people to die whilst scum bags have all these "civil rights". Its absolute crap and it needs to change.

People say jokes like "blow them up with RPG's" or Apache helicopters - well why not? Theyr'e endangering everyones life so why not use deadly force (obviusly not Apaches/RPG's but why not deadly force??) What excuse is there to not do this? Are you saying their life is more valuable than an innocent citizen?

They then went on to say they should only chase people in a "life threatening" situation, so e.g. murderers would be chased but not car thiefs or drug runners. Well that sounds like a great community to live in dosn't it? All the do-gooders can hold hands and sing and pat each other on the back in their Bondi apartments with their education programs and lectures "now Johnny its OK if you steal that car just don't murder any children OK?" What BS.

Harden up, kick some heads, PITT manouver these %^&$ off the road into a tree in the first 5 seconds of the chase.

JC · 23-03-2010, 09:44 AM

If police don't chase speeding drivers, then overall criminal activity will increase as the bad guys will simply get in a car and start driving fast because they know police won't chase. The end result will be a complete loss of law and order. Now, that might be a bit of a stretch, but I don't think it's far from what may happen - as much as I love Mad Max, I don't look forward to the days when our society becomes like that.

Do I feel sorry for the family that died - yes. Would I be angry and inconsolable if that were my family? Yes. Would I blame the police, or the person breaking the law? The idiot breaking the law (who in this case at least got a deserving result - not for stealing the car, but for deciding to run and then killing someone else; death is a fitting penalty for that fool).

We are running out of space in our jails, but I think we need to increase the penalties for thieves, especially car thieves who the engage in high speed pursuits. This fool had just gotten out of hospital after being in a coma as a result of his last high speed chase in a stolen car. He should not have been allowed to roam free, IMO.

Merlin - 100% agree with your post.

GT0132 · 23-03-2010, 09:53 AM

Depends on the severity of the crime. If the chasee is a highly dangerous armed robber, psycopathic murderer wanted in all 8 states and territories then by all means chase him but if he's a simply a petty car thief or shoplifter then maybe not

Wally · 23-03-2010, 10:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UNR8D

, can you imagine how they felt when they turned up to the scene?..

rant off.

I'm not staunch like a copper, but I know how I'd feel........ like I had just contributed to several people's death.

We don't condone capital punishment for murderers, but we seem far less concerned for human life when someone steals a car.

FPV+fteT3 · 23-03-2010, 10:18 AM

This is obviously in response to what happened in canberra recently the police have a job to do and without having x-ray vision or being gifted with mind reading they really dont know why or what other offences may have occured causing the car to not want to stop they have no choice but to try to stop the car. Having said that I think my position is clear chases must continue if thats what it takes. I assume if you are following this particular story in a search for the truth in this matter you would have read what is in in this link. Police knew this guy was a danger to himself and others what has to be asked is why was he still on the streets? not should chases continue.

http://news.ninemsn.com.au/national/...mily-he-killed

**ebxr8240** · 23-03-2010, 10:27 AM

Ummm ??
How is a car doing 200+ kph going to stop another speeding car ???
Trust me it doesn't work.. Even in speedway at much lower speeds it doesn't...
Chasing wannkers like this goes back to the cowboy days..
Police can follow these cars and eventually catch them in a combined pursuit...
Look at your 4 y.o child and think Ahhh yes they can be at risk to catch a speeding, thief.. No thanks...
BUT that doesn't mean let these low lives go... The car will have to stop in the end and there would be DNA in car to prove he was driving etc...
Need to take the cowboy and Indians type of chase out of the equation..
Btw I have a NICE car stolen by these low life a-- holes...
Not blaming Police... But lets not let a bad situation a devastation like this one turned out...

colossus · 23-03-2010, 10:28 AM

Thinking outside the square for a sec - maybe the technical minded could tell me if its possible - can a Hwy patrol car be fitted with a radio device which overrides all car radio channels in an emergency situation?

Think of the tunnels around Sydney, Melbourne ect. When there is an incident they have some sort of device that takes over your car radio and tells you about the incident and to switch off the engine ect. Happened to me yesterday.

Could such a device be activated in a pursuit with say a 1km range from the patrol car. So you get a warning cutting over your radio? So you know to be extra vigilant and proceed carefully through lights ect.

**DJR-351** · 23-03-2010, 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by geckoGT

By the way, the difference between the thread title and the poll questions is a bit confusing.

That's correct....my vote means nothing as my answer was in relation to the thread question before realising the poll question was the exact reversal....

My answer to the thread question: Yes....

To the poll question: No....

geckoGT · 23-03-2010, 10:42 AM

I think a point that is being lost here is that out of all the pursuits involving police across australia, how many end in a serious crash such as this? I do not know the actual statistic but I do know that the vast majority are either called off before they get too unsafe or the person is caught without serious crash. The number that result in a serious crash would be way less than 1% at an estimate, we have what, a couple per year.

Now lets put that into perspective. How many die in high speed crashes not involving police? I have been to two deaths this year for that. How many die as a result of people running red lights? I have been to one death this year from that. How many die as a result of drunk driving? I have been to one large crash (luckily no deaths and only moderate injuries) so far this year.

My point is, you are more likely to be injured or killed on the road as a result of someone breaking road laws and driving dangerously than you are as a result of a high speed chase. At least in the chase, there are many mechanisms in use by the police to mitigate hazards to public safety. In the scenario of some moron in a stolen car trying to replicate his last game of Need for Speed, there are no such mechanisms without the police presence.

The large problem is, by banning pursuits and removing the ability of the police to stop this illegal activity on our roads, we are only going to achieve one thing. We will end up allowing people to drive as fast and as dangerously as they dare because they know police will not chase them. Think of it this way, I have a 290 kw SP, what is to stop me taping over or removing my plates (to prevent identity) and going out onto the M1 and set land speed records, I bet I could do 250+. What stops me know (apart from intelligence, respect for laws and moral responsibility) is the fact that the moment I started doing this I know the cops will chase me and there is a better than average chance I will get caught. Take away that opportunity for the police to stop me, I then have free reign to do whatever I like.

So banning pursuits is likely to cause a situation where although serious crashes no longer occur as a result of police chases (a very small percentage), more crashes will result from illegal activity due to an increase in this activity (due to the loss of law enforcement capability), resulting in a lot more deaths than we have now. The effect would be eradication of the lesser of the two evils and increase the greater evil, good plan.

The police do not cause these morons to act he way they do, it is the actions of the morons that cause the chase, not the other way around. After talking to a few cops, trust me, with the mountain of paperwork and level of investigation that follows all pursuits, they do not want to chase bad guys and would much rather they just pull over.

View Poll Results: should police be involved in high speed chases
yes	35	62.50%
no	21	37.50%
Voters: 56. You may not vote on this poll