Tired of getting ripped by big retailers

[Crazy Dazz]

The more paranoid of us always worried this day would come, and I swear that in some areas it already has...

We've fallen for the trap of buying cheap Chinese stuff, because it was , well, cheap. (I know I certainly have.)
Local producers, manufacturers, retailers, etc, have slowly been put out of business. Products that were available from dozens of stores or even "factory direct" are now only found in the massive chain retailers who ship it in by the boat-load.
Now this mightn't be so bad if we were all still getting to benefit from the cheap prices. But alarmingly what I see now in many cases is the prices of Chinese rubbish rocketing back up to what we used to pay for QUALITY local stuff. It seems that in the absence of stiff local competition, somebody somewhere is ripping us off.

[xisled]

For me when buying an item it is all about convince.

If I can go to a shop and I can be in and out, I will buy it. I do not care where it was made or produced. Even on big purchasers like my TV. I went to Harvey Norman chose the one I wanted and paid for it.

Most items I buy these days aren’t cheap small stuff so I am not worried about cheap Chinese brands. The problem is everyone wants everything for stuff all and China seen a market for this.

[CoupeKing]

When I can, I try to support the small business man. Its almost a challenge in itself just to find them let alone justify paying a little extra. But I prefer to spread my business around rather than run to the first franchise. Everyone`s circumstances are different whether it be financial, location, 6 kids, time factor etc.

[SVR73]

I don't go anywhere near retailers or Chinese product. Sadly the masses were the ones who started demanding cheap, I'm a quality buyer and get most things manufacturer direct or through wholesale distributors not the big retailers.

[olfella]

Originally Posted by SVR73

I don't go anywhere near retailers or Chinese product. Sadly the masses were the ones who started demanding cheap, I'm a quality buyer and get most things manufacturer direct or through wholesale distributors not the big retailers.

I got a camera recently and did a bit of price matching. It is hard to beat grey items (on quality items) just for the sake of a twelve month warranty which probably will never be needed. I think the retailers here have not done themselves any favours.

[ILLaViTaR]

It's a shame the retaliers were too greedy. Mark ups of over 400% were not uncommon, now if it was 10% after expenses/overheads etc then maybe I would feel some sympathy for Gerry Harvey. Everyone would've been happier too, as it's more convenient than the internet, however was unregulated... until the internet came along.

It's not restricted to only chinese rubbish, quality oem parts are simply cheaper online than in stores, it's the exact same part. An Apple iphone charger is $30-$40 from jb without the cable, I can still get it from ebay (that's genuine apple/oem not chinese rubbish) for $16. Nuff said

[ILLaViTaR]

I don't think it's got anything to do with being restricted to cheap chinese crap or selling out australian business (more so Gerry Harvey and his friends trying to scare negativity and pessimism into us consumers to retain their archaic monopoly. It's simply spreading fear/propaganda onto consumers, ie the false image they paint of every online seller being some shady offshore blackmarket..

http://www.allansbillyhyde.com.au/pr...cts_Pedal.aspx

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Boss-DD20...item27e6a472cd

Here's how it actually is in the real world so please don't buy into Gerry Harvey's bs.

Same product, same warranty, both local, over 30% off!!!

The only problem in the market these days is fairness.. well as far as Gerry Harvey is concerned.

[Stefan]

Gee Crazy Dazz, under what rock have you been living?

We've been at a point of no return on this issue for a decade.

[jpblue1000]

And Im pretty sure nobody woke up one morning and decided to only want cheap stuff, the bargain has always been sought but the definition of bargain has changed with the times!
the downward pressure on prices due to consumer pressure and competition and the upward demand on profit by shareholders was aleviated by retailers purchasing product cheaper from OS, with greater margins, even after shipping, than procuring it locally. Or the local suppliers feelingt he pressure needed to produce the item cheaper so if the quality wasn't important they would import an alternate cheap product already being made, If quality was important then they would manufacture themselves or have manufactured under licenses etc offshore to a higher standard but still lower cost.
a problem that has been growing for a long time, and many are only becoming aware of it as a problem when the **** hits the fan.
JP

[blueoval]

Originally Posted by jpblue1000

And Im pretty sure nobody woke up one morning and decided to only want cheap stuff, the bargain has always been sought but the definition of bargain has changed with the times!
the downward pressure on prices due to consumer pressure and competition and the upward demand on profit by shareholders was aleviated by retailers purchasing product cheaper from OS, with greater margins, even after shipping, than procuring it locally. Or the local suppliers feelingt he pressure needed to produce the item cheaper so if the quality wasn't important they would import an alternate cheap product already being made, If quality was important then they would manufacture themselves or have manufactured under licenses etc offshore to a higher standard but still lower cost.
a problem that has been growing for a long time, and many are only becoming aware of it as a problem when the **** hits the fan.
JP

spot on. It will be the shareholders wanting profits that will make manufacturers/resellers etc of large businesses look for ways in cutting costs to achieve this.

All in the name of making profit even if the quality was in question.

[jpblue1000]

Originally Posted by blueoval

spot on. It will be the shareholders known as Baby Boomers wanting profits that will make manufacturers/resellers etc of large businesses look for ways in cutting costs to achieve this.

All in the name of making profit even if the quality was in question.

[danzvtil]

retailers don't price goods based on what they cost plus x margin. They price them at what the market will pay. Once consumer items get so cheap, then the customers expectations change markedly, ie-if I pay $7 for a white tee shirt, I don't care if it lasts a season, I can afford to chuck it out and buy another.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by danzvtil

retailers don't price goods based on what they cost plus x margin. They price them at what the market will pay. Once consumer items get so cheap, then the customers expectations change markedly, ie-if I pay $7 for a white tee shirt, I don't care if it lasts a season, I can afford to chuck it out and buy another.

Even expensive T-shirts are **** though.

I specifically sourced out American Apparel T-shirts because they were made in the USA instead of some 3rd world hole like Bangladesh, and they were still poor quality and thin.

[Crazy Dazz]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

Even expensive T-shirts are **** though.

I specifically sourced out American Apparel T-shirts because they were made in the USA instead of some 3rd world hole like Bangladesh, and they were still poor quality and thin.

Yep, that's the problem.
Time was you paid a proportionate cost for a quality product, but we were happy to accept rubbish in return for cheap prices.
Now, ALL that's available is rubbish, but it aint cheap anymore.

I'm buying some basic cupboards for loft storage. Time was you could get these from dozens of retailers and many "factory direct" cabinet makers around Perth. They were always basic, melamine and laminated chipboard or MDF, but they were reasonably sturdy and did the job. Now days your choice is IKEA or Bunnings, they are ridiculously expensive and lousy chinese rubbish. I'm actually paying a small premium ABOVE their prices to get something locally made, but even he has to use crappy Asian board because the local manufacturers have gone out of business.
And again, if it was a case of "Comparative Advantage," we make X becuase we're good at it, and you make Y because you're cheaper, then fine. But its not. Their stuff is rubbish, and somebody somewhere is making one hell of a mark up.

Bunnings just opened a stupendously ginormous warehouse in Joondalup. The last one they had was already twice as big as it needed to be, but then Masters built one, so they had to build one even bigger. And who pays for this lunacy? We do with their huge markups.

Furniture generally is something that really cheeses me off.
In the not too distant past, you could get;
Low quality melamine and veneer from places like "Furniture Spot" & K-Mart. It was poor quality, looked terrible, and didn't last, but it was CHEAP.
Cheap furniture from Indonesia that had been made with an Axe and looked like it,
Reasonable quality Pine Furniture at a reasonable price, or
Decent quality furniture for which you paid commensurately.
Now it is mostly expensive, yet rubbish, unless you go for the uber-expensive high-end stuff.

I have always been happy to PAY for stuff that lasts. Now it seems that furniture is practically a consumable.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by Crazy Dazz

Yep, that's the problem.
Time was you paid a proportionate cost for a quality product, but we were happy to accept rubbish in return for cheap prices.
Now, ALL that's available is rubbish, but it aint cheap anymore.\

Bunnings is cheap because all they sell is poor quality crap, even their plants are crap, I got two avocado trees from there, a Hass and a Bacon variety, the Bacon died and the Hass isn't growing and its not like I'm not looking after them, we've got very rich red soils here too.

Next time I'm getting them from Diggers or a nursery.

Even their tools, the best hand tools they seem to sell are only Sidcrome (which are crap anyway) and Kincrome, they don't have Gearwrench or SP Tools.

I've got two Sidcrome ratchets and I was reminded how crappy they are, especially the 1/4 inch one, every day. My great grandma had more teeth than that ratchet.

Or power tools they only sell some of DeWALT's stuff, some Makita and mostly cheap rubbish or the crappy green Bosch range.

Furniture is another good one, everything is expensive but its still cheap and crappily made stuff from China.

[Ford_The_Win]

You can still get quality, you just need to research your purchases more carefully. I always buy reputable brands and research product reliability and prices before I even set foot in a shop. Rarely does something I buy break or stop working, there is very little cheap junk in my house. I recently bought a new USA-made commercial grade clothes dryer online, all metal and designed to last 10,400 cycles before requiring service. It cost $1600, but it will take 25+ years to wear out. I also bought an Australian made Kelvinator fridge about 12 months ago. Researching and buying online is the way to go.

[blueoval]

Originally Posted by Ford_The_Win

You can still get quality, you just need to research your purchases more carefully. I always buy reputable brands and research product reliability and prices before I even set foot in a shop. Rarely does something I buy break or stop working, there is very little cheap junk in my house. I recently bought a new USA-made commercial grade clothes dryer online, all metal and designed to last 10,400 cycles before requiring service. It cost $1600, but it will take 25+ years to wear out. I also bought an Australian made Kelvinator fridge about 12 months ago. Researching and buying online is the way to go.

^^^ This. The mrs bought an LG fridge about 4 years ago without me being there at the time and we recently had to replace the seals in doors as they were tearing themselves off. Its a dual opening fridge. The fridge was cheap at the time which attracted her, but if we had of done our research prior to purchase we would have realized that the fridge seals are very very rare to find and stupidly expensive to replace --> 2 months to order in & $350 later I had to get them ordered in from bloody china/korea and even the fridge seal guy with 20 years experience said he had never seen that type of seal before said and to don't ever waste your money on the cheap crap like that again. To avoid the seals breaking again, I have to open and close both the doors identically as the design is poor.

I'll be going Kelvinator or Westinghouse where the parts are readily accessible next time.

An expensive lesson learnt.

[Pedro]

Originally Posted by danzvtil

retailers don't price goods based on what they cost plus x margin. They price them at what the market will pay. Once consumer items get so cheap, then the customers expectations change markedly, ie-if I pay $7 for a white tee shirt, I don't care if it lasts a season, I can afford to chuck it out and buy another.

Really! when did this come about? I wholesaled to retailers for 30 years and cost + margin is what they all did. You present an article to a retailer and he/she hits their calculator with a profit factor and if the final figure is to high in their opinion, they don't buy it.
And as far as outrageous profits go, I see watches in the big jewellery chain windows marked up 800%. I know because I was I was in that industry and I recognise models and can often identify what Chinese factory made them. The Chinese factories can manufacture an analogue watch on a metal bracelet (alloy) for USD$1.50!

[Crazy Dazz]

Originally Posted by ILLaViTaR

lol $329 for a boss dd gigashit... No wonder Hydes/allens have been going out of business for years. Good on em. Obviously the majority of consumers don't agree that is "proportionate pricing"

I'll rebuke your claim by asking you to show me where in melbourne can I currently buy a fractal audio Axe Fx II?? It actually appears you can only get the quality stuff online, as the stores will only distribue the lower tier crap..

Stop trying to destroy a good thing! I don't want to be forced to pay over 2k for some piece of **** ungiggable Marshall valvestate pos simply because of the inhibit right wing entitlements these old age retailers seem to feel as their birthright..

Nope, I got nothing, anyone here able to translate?

[Crazy Dazz]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

Bunnings is cheap because all they sell is poor quality crap, even their plants are crap, I got two avocado trees from there, a Hass and a Bacon variety, the Bacon died and the Hass isn't growing and its not like I'm not looking after them, we've got very rich red soils here too.

Next time I'm getting them from Diggers or a nursery.

Even their tools, the best hand tools they seem to sell are only Sidcrome (which are crap anyway) and Kincrome, they don't have Gearwrench or SP Tools.

I've got two Sidcrome ratchets and I was reminded how crappy they are, especially the 1/4 inch one, every day. My great grandma had more teeth than that ratchet.

Or power tools they only sell some of DeWALT's stuff, some Makita and mostly cheap rubbish or the crappy green Bosch range.

Furniture is another good one, everything is expensive but its still cheap and crappily made stuff from China.

And they are not that cheap any-more, that's what gets me.
Not so long ago, when you looked at any category of tool, there was a varity of quality and commensurate prices. If I wanted something for a once off, or occasional use, I would buy the cheap chinese junk. Now, that cheap junk is nolonger cheap, and as you say, they parade out stuff like Kinchrome like its some premium product (and price accordingly.)

[GasoLane]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

Bunnings is cheap because all they sell is poor quality crap, even their plants are crap, I got two avocado trees from there, a Hass and a Bacon variety, the Bacon died and the Hass isn't growing and its not like I'm not looking after them, we've got very rich red soils here too.

Even their tools, the best hand tools they seem to sell are only Sidcrome (which are crap anyway) and Kincrome, they don't have Gearwrench or SP Tools.

I've got two Sidcrome ratchets and I was reminded how crappy they are, especially the 1/4 inch one, every day. My great grandma had more teeth than that ratchet.

But with Bunnings if you tell them the plant died most times they'll replace it.

Sidchrome must have gone down hill then. I still have a lot of my spanners (the ones my son actually returned!) and the 40yo ratchet still works perfectly.

[danzvtil]

Originally Posted by Pedro

Really! when did this come about? I wholesaled to retailers for 30 years and cost + margin is what they all did. You present an article to a retailer and he/she hits their calculator with a profit factor and if the final figure is to high in their opinion, they don't buy it.
And as far as outrageous profits go, I see watches in the big jewellery chain windows marked up 800%. I know because I was I was in that industry and I recognise models and can often identify what Chinese factory made them. The Chinese factories can manufacture an analogue watch on a metal bracelet (alloy) for USD$1.50!

That method worked back when you COULD add a reasonable margin and still sell every piece of merchandise you could get your hands on, but competition rules now. If your hardware giant or supermarket can get another 5 or 10% margin without you going elsewhere, then they will.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by GasOLane

But with Bunnings if you tell them the plant died most times they'll replace it.

Sidchrome must have gone down hill then. I still have a lot of my spanners (the ones my son actually returned!) and the 40yo ratchet still works perfectly.

The old Sidchrome spanners are really good quality, one of the old boys at work had a full set of the forged ones that came out of the Melbourne factory back in the day, light weight and well made.

The crap that comes out of their Chinese or what ever Asian country operation today is exactly that, crap, especially the spanners.

The problems I find with their ratchets is that they don't have enough teeth, especially on the 1/4" ratchets where you're going to be using them in very tight spaces on cars, you need lots of teeth so it will click with the tiniest movement, with the Sidchrome 1/4" ratchets it always seems that click is just out of reach.

They're fairly strong though, I guess as a result of not having many teeth they must be bigger.

Their 1/2" is a joke though, with that little button on the side of the head.

[jg33ht]

Originally Posted by danzvtil

retailers don't price goods based on what they cost plus x margin. They price them at what the market will pay.

In most cases that I know of, small retailers DO price goods on cost plus x margin.

Also consider that most wholesalers here, now retail their own product. So for certain well known clothing and giftware lines it's just not possible to price them at 'what the market will pay'.


Outrageous mark ups these days are mostly confined to one area of retail and that area is your friendly jewellery store...

[LG17]

Small 7 pin round trailer plug (metal) - Supercrap was $13.48 - $19.78.
Just bought a Narva one from a little auto parts outlet in Nanango for $7.50.

[tut0r]

I buy all my tools online got a 64piece sidchrome set for 180? As opposed to retailers selling for 250 +. I agree with 1/2 drive has that switch in a stupid place can't stand it and the 1/4 could use more teeth, but other than that I haven't had any problems. I'm a painter by trade and sometimes fix up old furniture, you'd be surprised at what gets thrown out and the profit margin I can make on fixing it up and selling it especially when all you get from IKEA is laminated chipboard

[hawkgirl]

Originally Posted by Crazy Dazz

Nope, I got nothing, anyone here able to translate?

he's talking guitar amps & pedals

[Crazy Dazz]

Originally Posted by hawkgirl

he's talking guitar amps & pedals

right,
so I imagine that explains "ungiggable Marshall valvestate pos"?

What about "the inhibit right wing entitlements"?

[comagutsa]

bunnings isnt cheap anymore its a bloody rip off now eg they wanted nearly $90 for 30m of 1.2 high chicken wire , went to a fencing place and got 1.8m high 50m long for $95, and their star pickets were half the price of bunnings
i buy alot of stuff from the US as i can get it cheaper and quicker than i can get stuff in australia
eg i buy alot of gun/motorbike/car stuff and it can get to me in WA in approx 5-7 days and stuff from the eastern states takes over 7 days WTF
ADI gun powder which is made in australia, now the price of it has gone up since winchester has brought them (about $10 more for 500grams) so in WA we are buying a 500gr anywhere from $55 to $65, but the same stuff thats made in australia and then sent over to the US only costs $20 ..how does that work ???? its made here, shipped over there but cost less
also i just brought 4 water gen filters for my samsung fridge, in the shops here they want $95 each , i just brought 4 on ebay from the eastern states for $125 including postage ..mark up anyone

like anything you need to do your home work before you buy anything

[hawkgirl]

Originally Posted by Crazy Dazz

right,
so I imagine that explains "ungiggable Marshall valvestate pos"?

What about "the inhibit right wing entitlements"?

no sorry, only speak guitar not rant