Nissan hits back at Porsche cheat claim

jeune · 08-10-2008, 03:13 PM

http://carsguide.news.com.au/site/mo...e_cheat_claim/

FPVmaniac · 08-10-2008, 03:55 PM

Worst move for Porsche to even bring this up! Just shows how concerned they really are about the GTR's levels of performance... Just stop complaining and build a faster car!

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Following on from Porsche’s claim that Nissan must have achieved a record lap time of the Nurburgring by using non production racing tyres on its GT-R, Nissan have officially responded.

“The final word from us is that it was done on absolutely standard tyres which are available to customers in the showroom. They’re not trick tyres – absolutely standard tyres, normal road tyres.” Neil Reeve, spokesman Nissan Europe.

Apparently, the tyres used were Dunlop SP Sport Tyres which come standard on the entry level GT-R, not the more expensive Bridgestone Potenza run-flats on the upper spec grade.

Reeves also said “it’s flattering that Porsche have brought themselves a GT-R and flown it to Germany”.

Car magazine recently lapped the Nissan GT-R and two Porsche 911’s around the Anglesey Race Track in the United Kingdom during its 2008 Performance Car of the Year awards. Porsche would not have been too happy to hear that the GT-R recorded a time of 1.00.6 whilst the more expensive 911S PDK recorded a significantly slower 1.03.2. Even more worrying for Porsche is that it’s 911 GT2, more than twice as expensive as the GT-R, lapped the circuit in 1.01.2.

Source: Nissan responds to Porsche’s cheating accusation

bdave351 · 08-10-2008, 03:59 PM

So the special optional tyres eh? That explains about 2 seconds a lap. Where did the other 23 go?

Booooooooooooooooosting.

bah....bloody playstation ricer generation will beleive anything!! (message me if you want to add me on PS3 btw hahaha)

nugget378 · 08-10-2008, 04:08 PM

They can respond all they like,but the times are suspect IMO...
As bdave351 said,23 seconds a lap is a light year ahead of the time difference others are seeing..

Rev28K · 08-10-2008, 04:41 PM

The German magazine Auto Motor and Sport regularly do “super tests” where they get ex-bike racer Horst von Saurma to do a time around the ‘ring, they also have a showdown for the fastest TUV legal spec road car. Although car companies might still be able to supply “ringers” this could be a way of settling this. I’d be interested in seeing the AM&S times around there in both cars.

Footnote – Porsche reckon that their own top test driver (ex-rally champ Walter Rhorl) is a second or two quicker around the ring than Von Saurma (which I don’t think is too bad at all)

freaky · 08-10-2008, 04:52 PM

I dont think Porsche have anything to worry about..

From all the emerging info around the net, it seems the GTR has been underdeveloped in a sense regarding durability, hence the lower cost. By the sounds of it, the maintenance and upkeep sound horendous. (Like a high maintenance woman. lol).

I would bet that if a GTR and Porsche ran around a track for a day, the porsche will still be lapping come sundown whereas the GTR maybe having a gearbox or 2 replaced.

Wretched · 08-10-2008, 04:54 PM

I found this to be an interesting read.

Ives · 08-10-2008, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bdave351

So the special optional tyres eh? That explains about 2 seconds a lap. Where did the other 23 go?

Booooooooooooooooosting.

bah....bloody playstation ricer generation will beleive anything!! (message me if you want to add me on PS3 btw hahaha)

The Nurburgring Nordschleife is a 20something km track. A car that's 2 sec faster on a normal race track could be 20something sec faster at the ring.

4Vman · 08-10-2008, 05:18 PM

This GTR thing is rapidly turning into what appears to be a one lap wonder.....
Early signs are it'll be more fragile than a T series owner's ego... (joking ok!)

Grab a GT2 and GTR, 100 laps of Lemans, lets see who makes the distance...

Ives · 08-10-2008, 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

Grab a GT2 and GTR, 100 laps of Lemans, lets see who makes the distance...

I'd like to see ANY road car* finish a 100 continuous hot laps.

*Road car = bone-stock... straight out of the dealer.

4Vman · 08-10-2008, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ives

I'd like to see ANY road car* finish a 100 continuous hot laps.

*Road car = bone-stock... straight out of the dealer.

True, but If there was ever a brand that would have a car that would do it, it would be Porsche... not nissan...

I think too many people spend too much time on PS2 or watching "Fast and the furious"...

TZENU · 08-10-2008, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

Grab a GT2 and GTR, 100 laps of Lemans, lets see who makes the distance...

That would be good, but i don't think Nissan would want to end up with egg all over their faces

Rodp · 08-10-2008, 05:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nugget378

They can respond all they like,but the times are suspect IMO...
As bdave351 said,23 seconds a lap is a light year ahead of the time difference others are seeing..

The GT-R lapped 2.6 seconds quicker than a GT3 on the Top Gear test track. Different day, possibly different driver but that's a significant amount of time difference over such a short track. That could easily translate to ~20 seconds on the Burger Ring, IMO.

4Vman · 08-10-2008, 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rodp

The GT-R lapped 2.6 seconds quicker than a GT3 on the Top Gear test track. Different day, possibly different driver but that's a significant amount of time difference over such a short track. That could easily translate to ~20 seconds on the Burger Ring, IMO.

A friends V8SC lapped winton on a test day 1.8 seconds slower than a previous outing, same car, same driver, same track, different day, different conditions....
You can't accurately compare lap times unless they're done on the same day and conditions, too many variables such as track temp, rubber on the track etc.....

Jondalar · 08-10-2008, 06:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bdave351

So the special optional tyres eh? That explains about 2 seconds a lap. Where did the other 23 go?

Booooooooooooooooosting.

bah....bloody playstation ricer generation will beleive anything!! (message me if you want to add me on PS3 btw hahaha)

hey don't knock PS3, it's the closest I can afford to get to actually racing a supercar on world famous tracks ;)

Re the GTR just read a write up in Top Gear Aus magazine they said it felt rock solid, as built to last as the Porche...

Actually just re-read the original story about Porche's doubts, they ran a GTR with NEW tyres, new road tyres are never going to be as fast as well scrubbed down ones, could explain a lot of the difference.

Rev28K · 08-10-2008, 06:30 PM

Given the Horst Von Saurma 7:50 ‘ring lap time posted in another thread I’ll be interested to see what the cars (Porsche GT2 and Nissan GTR) do in this years Motor PCOTY final.

Warren Luff driving down at Phillip Island – I’d be expecting low 1:40’s at least on a quick track.

p.s. PI is a “power” track so the big engines cars (XR6T, HSV’s, V8’s) will have more of a gap than they used to compared to the quicker of the little-engined cars that handled well.

nugget378 · 08-10-2008, 07:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rodp

The GT-R lapped 2.6 seconds quicker than a GT3 on the Top Gear test track. Different day, possibly different driver but that's a significant amount of time difference over such a short track. That could easily translate to ~20 seconds on the Burger Ring, IMO.

I can be a second or 2 slower over 400m in my car,depending on track conditions and driving,so that test wont convince me sorry..

**DJM83** · 08-10-2008, 08:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

This GTR thing is rapidly turning into what appears to be a one lap wonder.....
Early signs are it'll be more fragile than a T series owner's ego... (joking ok!)

Grab a GT2 and GTR, 100 laps of Lemans, lets see who makes the distance...

Thats low, at least its a muscle car.

One lap wonder, id like to see any road car (off the showroom floor) last 100 laps or the 'ring'

4Vman · 08-10-2008, 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 51RTE

Thats low, at least its a muscle car.

One lap wonder, id like to see any road car (off the showroom floor) last 100 laps or the 'ring'

GTR is not a musclecar....

flappist · 08-10-2008, 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

GTR is not a musclecar....

Neither is the other one so be careful of cracks in fragile goods....

mongoloid · 08-10-2008, 08:43 PM

*readies hose*

**DJM83** · 08-10-2008, 08:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

GTR is not a musclecar....

Read PM

HEMI POWER · 09-10-2008, 12:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

This GTR thing is rapidly turning into what appears to be a one lap wonder.....
Early signs are it'll be more fragile than a T series owner's ego... (joking ok!)

Grab a GT2 and GTR, 100 laps of Lemans, lets see who makes the distance...

Your not wrong there.

bdave351 · 09-10-2008, 01:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rodp

The GT-R lapped 2.6 seconds quicker than a GT3 on the Top Gear test track. Different day, possibly different driver but that's a significant amount of time difference over such a short track. That could easily translate to ~20 seconds on the Burger Ring, IMO.

The point however Rod is that a decent driver couldnt produce times within 25 seconds in the same car. Not a different car.......

When not just porsche but another mob have both failed to get even close then you know its all funny.

Bah from the links any car that i designed to lunch gear boxes after SIX full power launches is a sad joke.

JC · 09-10-2008, 01:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wretched

I found this to be an interesting read.

Good read!

xurbanx · 09-10-2008, 02:43 AM

Very good read that

mik · 09-10-2008, 02:43 AM

agreed!

loltastic · 09-10-2008, 08:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nugget378

I can be a second or 2 slower over 400m in my car,depending on track conditions and driving,so that test wont convince me sorry..

So you're a professional racing driver are you? If not, your comment is redundant as Porsche and Nissan both used professional racing drivers, and actually Nissan used an Ex F1 racing champion who did thousands of laps around the ring prior to his official run.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bdave351

Bah from the links any car that i designed to lunch gear boxes after SIX full power launches is a sad joke.

You design cars? What was the last one you designed?

I'll assume that's not what you meant, and comment on the other meaning. The guy who's gearbox was lunched said he used launch control 20 times in 2 weeks. That's almost 3 times a day on a brand new car. Go buy a new anything, and do redline clutch dumps 3 times a day for the next 3 weeks and see how your driveline goes. Ferraris F1 gearbox in the 599GTB is completely broken after 3 LC launches - I spose that's a crap car too? And how do we know this guy only launched it 20 times? It might of been a hundred times. Serves the moron right for abusing his brand new car thinking it's unbreakable.

Rev28K · 09-10-2008, 09:33 AM

Nissan used an Ex F1 racing champion? Champion = won the championship

Honda used Ayrton Senna's inputs in some stages of the NSX development, McClaren used Hakinnen for the F1 and Ferrari used Schumi for the FXX.

flappist · 09-10-2008, 09:35 AM

I remember reading on a forum somewhere back in early 2005 where somebody covered 0-400m in a FPV F6 in less than 14 seconds and was quicker than the more powerful larger engined models.

No one believed it.
Couldn't happen.

Wheels couldn't do it.
MOTOR didn't get close.
LS1 owners and enthusiasts laughed at it constantly.
Various Falcon owning "experts" joined in the chorus.

Then someone else did it (me)
Then lots of people did it.

Funny how things that upset the incumbent status quo are often so difficult for so many to accept.,,,,,

If Porsche was truly so superior then the Corvette LS9 and the Ford GT would not also be kicking its bum either would they?

In the words od my buddy Basil ........ "Erwähnen Sie nicht den Krieg"