Puma Axed except for EV

[kevino]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

No, my boobs are hairy and the wrong shape

Wow its that dam Damien Parker again.

[ToryMikey]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

Female 30-something Millennial

image

Does anyone feel like buying me a RAV4 hybrid?

I wish I could afford a RAV4

Ahhhhh I'd love a RAV4 but couldn't justify a car that big just for me

image

Ford isn't converting this demographic into Puma sales, but Toyota is turning them into RAV4 hybrid customers hand over fist.

See how they all know what the RAV4 is?

Could it be because Toyota actually spend money on advertising? Toyota know how to sell the dream. They sell the lifestyle, whether it's the lifestyle you have or the one you wish you had. Look at a Corolla ad, it's twenty somethings meeting and falling in love. Look at a Camry ad, it's all about Dad playing with the kids. Kluger ad? The best place to raise a family.

The last time I saw a Ford ad was when the FG was released and it was some pathetic thing begging you to test drive and compare...please!!!

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by ToryMikey

Could it be because Toyota actually spend money on advertising? Toyota know how to sell the dream. They sell the lifestyle, whether it's the lifestyle you have or the one you wish you had. Look at a Corolla ad, it's twenty somethings meeting and falling in love. Look at a Camry ad, it's all about Dad playing with the kids. Kluger ad? The best place to raise a family.

The last time I saw a Ford ad was when the FG was released and it was some pathetic thing begging you to test drive and compare...please!!!

Is there a more catchy song in automotive advertising than the Land Cruiser drives you home number.

If im up in parts unknown
Land of bush, dirt and stone
If its weeks since a shower
I need help within the hour
Theres something I'll tell you for sure
Not a lie its almost law
This Landcruiser drives us home
This Landcruiser drives us...home

[DFB FGXR6]

Originally Posted by ToryMikey

Could it be because Toyota actually spend money on advertising? Toyota know how to sell the dream. They sell the lifestyle, whether it's the lifestyle you have or the one you wish you had. Look at a Corolla ad, it's twenty somethings meeting and falling in love. Look at a Camry ad, it's all about Dad playing with the kids. Kluger ad? The best place to raise a family.

The last time I saw a Ford ad was when the FG was released and it was some pathetic thing begging you to test drive and compare...please!!!

The thing is, how many Puma target buyers watch free to air TV, and are therefore seeing TV ads? I get where you are going with that, and I'm hardly in that age group now, but even I don't watch free-to-air TV, and the TV I do consume is excludes ALL ads. So, dumping money on TV ads is an act in setting fire to money when trying to reach a younger audience who consume media very differently now.

The above applies to a lot of brands, not just Ford.

[Polyal]

Ford have completely forgotten how to get new customers...it will bite them.

Of course they have done well with the ranger but they seem to only target the converted

[kevino]

That Puma 1 litre mhev sells for 38 k drive away in Nz so how do ( Nz controlled by Ford Ute Aus ) Ford Nz sell it at 38 Nz which is 36 Aus $

[Sprintey]

Originally Posted by kevino

That Puma 1 litre mhev sells for 38 k drive away in Nz so how do ( Nz controlled by Ford Ute Aus ) Ford Nz sell it at 38 Nz which is 36 Aus $

Not since the days of the 39K ZR Yaris hybrid (ie, now, sadly) have I heard so much asked for so little.

https://www.carsales.com.au/cars/det...-6320021/?Cr=0

[Blue_XR]

It's a shame that Ford have no idea how to sell a small/mid size SUV. Recently we bought a 2020 Escape (base model) with under 30,000kms for my elderly parents for ease of getting in an out of. I have driven the vehicle and I'm impressed. Great power compared to other mid sizers unless of course you opt for the CX5 Turbo which is more expensive. My parents won't be using the power, but it has heaps of features and safety which is impressive car for an entry level vehicle. I did look at the competition, however at the price bracket we were looking at the Escape was a no brainer. To me the other makes did look like base models where the escape doesn't.
We looked at the Puma but the Escape was just easier to get in an out of.
To get the same power level apart from the CX5 Turbo you need to step up to the Euros which cost a lot more.

[Charliewool]

Pretty amazing the 2L Escape output is more than the first HSV V8

[kevino]

I have been looking at Puma Forums Uk
Apparently the update Puma has been whacked upwards in price
A lot of the models are now unavailable with manual
The halo 1.5 manual st is deleted
Top St now is an over boosted triple with auto


It sounds like they are trying to reduce sales to make room on the production line for the Puma ev

It still surprises me though that they walked away from Aus sales of Puma and Escape

4000 odd sales they don’t need

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by kevino

I have been looking at Puma Forums Uk
Apparently the update Puma has been whacked upwards in price
A lot of the models are now unavailable with manual
The halo 1.5 manual st is deleted
Top St now is an over boosted triple with auto


It sounds like they are trying to reduce sales to make room on the production line for the Puma ev

It still surprises me though that they walked away from Aus sales of Puma and Escape

4000 odd sales they don’t need

Death by a thousand cuts, you leave market share to everyone else, oh this only sells a few units, get rid of it, this only sells a few units, get rid of it, this only sells a few units, get rid of it.

Then you end up like Isuzu with a 2 model range, and it leaves you exposed to legislation changes cropping up out of the blue.

Have a look at Toyota, they dominate the sales figures because they offer 20+ options to the market, they have something for everyone (if you've had a lobotomy and enjoy driving park benches).

How Ford treats Australia reminds me of GM and their entire RHD market pull-out.

[Itsme]

[QUOTE=Franco Cozzo;6874403
How Ford treats Australia reminds me of GM and their entire RHD market pull-out.[/QUOTE]

Might be true what you say but I think Ford is only interested in selling for a niche market here in Australia.
My next vehicle will certainly be not a ford vehicle, which is a pity since they do not have much of an offering.

Cheers

[kevino]

I m sure Ranger Everest are good for their intended use but I don’t need their capability or price
The only thing that could possibly interest me would be Puma ev but I suspect the asking price will be outside my capacity to pay

[Franco Cozzo]

There's no doubt they're the best Thailand Specials hands down, no one else can touch them in the entire category.

What's if you don't want Thailand Specials? That's my issue with Ford. They made absolutely wicked hatches, the stuff that come out of Ford Europe was the value for money king, then Ford Australia is like nah no Fiesta, Focus or Mondeo anymore.

I'm sure you're all surprised that I don't like dual cab utes, I'm a fan of the single cab tray back job, utility vehicle, but I also wouldn't mind one with a bit of pepper - 2.3L Ecoboost job would be the absolute tits for me. The working man's supercar.

The Raptor is the FIFO Lambo.

For me with the absolute state of the new car market it's basically cemented my thoughts that if I'm going to buy a new car again then it's going to be a Tesla Model 3.

If Ford Australia wants to be a Thailand Specials specialist then rebrand to Ford Ute/Commercial Vehicles.

And while they're at, offer the F650/F750.

[kevino]

Yeah no Euro Fords
As you say no Mondeo (dead) Fiesta (nearly dead) Focus (dies 2025) Escape Puma.

They have wiped out hatchback and small and mid sized suvs in the last couple of years.
No entry models.
No performance models under 60k.
Nothing for non ute buyers ( Everest at a stretch)

[DJM83]

Just had a look at FoA website.
In the performance area we have.
Ranger Raptor.
Mustang
Then Ford Performance, which includes both mustang/raptor and some blabbing about them coming to F1 and last years supercars.
Page is also dated 2022.
They've lost the plot IMO.
That FP area could have Fiesta/Focus ST, Mustang, Raptor (maybe a new Focus RS)
Ford US isnt really much better either having racecars listed in there which is pointless.
What a time to be alive as a Ford fan!

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by DJM83

Just had a look at FoA website.
In the performance area we have.
Ranger Raptor.
Mustang
Then Ford Performance, which includes both mustang/raptor and some blabbing about them coming to F1 and last years supercars.
Page is also dated 2022.
They've lost the plot IMO.
That FP area could have Fiesta/Focus ST, Mustang, Raptor (maybe a new Focus RS)
Ford US isnt really much better either having racecars listed in there which is pointless.
What a time to be alive as a Ford fan!

We're in that 1950s/early 1960s era of Ford where they had no motorsport program and no interest in sports cars, until Enzo Ferrari told them to go **** themselves

There was just one problem: Ford didn’t have a sports car in its portfolio, and there were no plans to build one. (Iacocca’s legendary Mustang was still a couple of years away from production.)

It was decided that the most expedient way bring a vehicle to market would be to acquire one. That’s when the idea was floated to purchase Ferrari, which in those years was primarily a race car company that sold street-legal machines only to fund its track exploits.

In the spring of 1963, after months of negotiation, an agreement seemed to be near. Ford would pay million to Enzo Ferrari for his company and all its assets. A former racer, Enzo was supposedly eager to put a deal together with Ford, a move that would relieve him of the burden of running the company day-to-day. But at the eleventh hour, Ferrari balked at a clause in the contract that said Ford would control the budget and, thus, all the decisions governing the Ferrari racing team. Enzo was unwilling to relinquish control of his company’s motorsports program. He told Ford’s representatives that he’d never sell under those terms—nor, he added, would he sell to an ugly company that builds ugly cars in an ugly factory. It is rumored that he also insulted Henry II personally by insinuating that he couldn’t hold a candle to his grandfather, the real Henry Ford.

To add even more insult to injury, Enzo then turned around and sold a majority stake in Ferrari to fellow Italian automaker Fiat. Some Ford executives, including the Deuce, speculated that Enzo was never serious about selling to Ford at all but had only negotiated with the company in order to pressure Fiat to come up in price. The ploy worked, and Henry II was left looking like a fool—without a ride.

https://www.forbes.com/wheels/news/f...n-auto-racing/

We need someone to insult the CEO of Ford again so they pull the finger out

[BENT_8]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

We're in that 1950s/early 1960s era of Ford where they had no motorsport program and no interest in sports cars, until Enzo Ferrari told them to go **** themselves



https://www.forbes.com/wheels/news/f...n-auto-racing/

We need someone to insult the CEO of Ford again so they pull the finger out

Enter BENT_8.

But ol' Benty never gained no traction in insulting the brand in the hope that they'd return it to its once former greatness because silly Benty chose a platform full of apologists...
And what do you get when you stop asking questions and instead make excuses...
Ford Ute Est. 2023

Flame away.

[Sprintey]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

We're in that 1950s/early 1960s era of Ford where they had no motorsport program and no interest in sports cars, until Enzo Ferrari told them to go **** themselves

No motorsport and Argentinian style numbers in the ask for the 'everyman's car'.

Originally Posted by DJM83

Just had a look at FoA website.
In the performance area we have.
Ranger Raptor.
Mustang
Then Ford Performance, which includes both mustang/raptor and some blabbing about them coming to F1 and last years supercars.
Page is also dated 2022.
They've lost the plot IMO.
That FP area could have Fiesta/Focus ST, Mustang, Raptor (maybe a new Focus RS)
Ford US isnt really much better either having racecars listed in there which is pointless.
What a time to be alive as a Ford fan!

They still win the handling/ride part for the everyday car, that's something that has continued from the early 2000s.

[CyberWasp]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

We need someone to insult the CEO of Ford again so they pull the finger out

I will, i would love to.

[Fast Eddie]

Originally Posted by DJM83

Just had a look at FoA website.
In the performance area we have.
Ranger Raptor.
Mustang
Then Ford Performance, which includes both mustang/raptor and some blabbing about them coming to F1 and last years supercars.
Page is also dated 2022.
They've lost the plot IMO.
That FP area could have Fiesta/Focus ST, Mustang, Raptor (maybe a new Focus RS)
Ford US isnt really much better either having racecars listed in there which is pointless.
What a time to be alive as a Ford fan!

At the time, I knew exactly why F.A. badge-engineered the Focus ST (nee XR5-Turbo). To this day, I totally disagreed with their decision. Same with the "XR4".

[Dr Smith]

Just yesterday, took our daughter's car to a car wash for a full detail...looked so bad I finally said enough....we're going to get this thing cleaned before it turns organic or that apple core wrapped in the tissue in the door pocket starts to grow.....

the car wash is next to Brighton Ford....any way.. my favourite salesperson spotted us and so we started chatting...his own words...."we don't know if it's the chicken or egg scenario....Ford Oz couldn't give us enough cars to sell for the last few years as we are tied to Europe for supply other than Ranger causing a loss in brand-loyal buyers who couldn't wait, plus we've had to raise prices to get some form of ROI on the reduced sales numbers... or... have we lost a generation of loyal passenger car buyers that started before shutting down production that moved to other brands and having available cars would make no difference?

And finally, I've never seen up close a Ranger Platinum and I must say, it's pretty damn nice.....

[kevino]

Originally Posted by Dr Smith

Just yesterday, took our daughter's car to a car wash for a full detail...looked so bad I finally said enough....we're going to get this thing cleaned before it turns organic or that apple core wrapped in the tissue in the door pocket starts to grow.....

the car wash is next to Brighton Ford....any way.. my favourite salesperson spotted us and so we started chatting...his own words...."we don't know if it's the chicken or egg scenario....Ford Oz couldn't give us enough cars to sell for the last few years as we are tied to Europe for supply other than Ranger causing a loss in brand-loyal buyers who couldn't wait, plus we've had to raise prices to get some form of ROI on the reduced sales numbers... or... have we lost a generation of loyal passenger car buyers that started before shutting down production that moved to other brands and having available cars would make no difference?

And finally, I've never seen up close a Ranger Platinum and I must say, it's pretty damn nice.....

So he was saying that his dealership could not get enough Puma or Esccapes?

[minheim]

Originally Posted by kevino

So he was saying that his dealership could not get enough Puma or Esccapes?

My understanding is that Ford Europe never prioritized production for Ford Australia and hence we got insufficient numbers to properly promote and sell those models ordered. I also wondered if another factor was out unique Australian Design Rules. ADRs made sense when we had big local manufacturing but not so much for a RHD market that is small in terms of comparative volume and with lots of importers. Would be much simplier for manufacturers if we had rules better aligned with the big markets.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by minheim

My understanding is that Ford Europe never prioritized production for Ford Australia and hence we got insufficient numbers to properly promote and sell those models ordered. I also wondered if another factor was out unique Australian Design Rules. ADRs made sense when we had big local manufacturing but not so much for a RHD market that is small in terms of comparative volume and with lots of importers. Would be much simplier for manufacturers if we had rules better aligned with the big markets.

My thoughts on it was Ford Europe throwing Ford Australia under the bus, but I also get the impression Ford Australia just threw its hands up in the air and decided to discontinue everything, rather than fight tooth and nail for its customers with orders being unfulfilled because of Ford internal politics.

I completely agree about the ADRs, they shouldn't exist anymore, if its good enough for SK/JP/USA/UK/EU then its good enough for Australia too. Too much ****ing red tape in this country with bullshit unique requirements causing dramas hurting customer choice.

When you're 0.00000001% of the global market why do we have specific rules? Its madness, who the **** is going to spend shitloads complying vehicles for our market specifically when you represent nothing?

[simon varley]

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

I completely agree about the ADRs, t

When you're 0.00000001% of the global market why do we have specific rules? Its madness, who the **** is going to spend shitloads complying vehicles for our market specifically when you represent nothing?

its not just the ADRs either. We are still running shitty Euro 5 emissions, and selling us Eu6 cars carries a significant premium. Practically the only other RHD country in the world that still runs Eu5 is Thailand, and they aren't a passenger car market. Nobody is going to develop a Eu5 car just for us.

[smoo]

Originally Posted by minheim

My understanding is that Ford Europe never prioritized production for Ford Australia and hence we got insufficient numbers to properly promote and sell those models ordered. I also wondered if another factor was out unique Australian Design Rules. ADRs made sense when we had big local manufacturing but not so much for a RHD market that is small in terms of comparative volume and with lots of importers. Would be much simplier for manufacturers if we had rules better aligned with the big markets.

What specifically needs changing to suit ADR?

[Dr Smith]

Originally Posted by smoo

What specifically needs changing to suit ADR?

Good question, I wonder how many could just be stated as "per (insert Country Reg. X.X" instead of page after page of compliance requirements....
You'll need a bit of time, ..scroll down to
Full list of Third Edition ADRs

110 ADR's
https://www.infrastructure.gov.au/in...alian%20market.

[Dr Smith]

Originally Posted by kevino

So he was saying that his dealership could not get enough Puma or Esccapes?

Yep...I know that to be true as I was an Escape customer ordering in Dec 2020 (edit mistakenly wrote Dec '21 originally) that cancelled 11 months later..., plus back a year earlier they stopped taking Transit Custom orders, and I literally walked in to place an order not caring when it arrived but the sales team said they had a draw full of orders and no idea on build dates, then finally the larger Transit van also had a stop on orders for a while.

[Sprintey]

Originally Posted by Dr Smith

or... have we lost a generation of loyal passenger car buyers that started before shutting down production that moved to other brands and having available cars would make no difference?

That's a really good question. Loyal passenger car buyer here (going out on limb that Territory was 'car-like', which it was), the replacement for these Fords is European and 2 to 2.5x the price, the ingredients previously were large, RWD/AWD, car not separate chassis, power which used to be 6 cylinders but now is more open to interpretation, reliability, longevity eg 20 year lifespan, simple mechanical, parts and dealership availability.

What Ford fits that bill today? Could be the Explorer, the Lincoln Aviator maybe? Would Bronco/Bronco Sport be this configuration?