Some jerks threw a trolley of a bridge... Hit my parked car.

Rolkus · 02-05-2015, 01:25 PM

In short, just curious to who is liable?

I parked overnight near a small bridge in Wyndham Vale.

Overnight, some (pure speculation) ******* decided to throw a trolley off the bridge. It landed in the bark near my car and fell on to my car.

It damaged the driver side rear-door and wheel-arch.

I've contacted Woolworths and informed them, and told they'll get back to me before Monday, but I expect little support from them as it didn't happen in the carpark.

My issue is in 2 weeks, I am trading it in towards my XR6T. Should I get it fixed before hand, or just trade it in with damage. I've gotten a quote for $500 to fix the damage, but it's $700 excess if done through insurance (no loss of rating, thanks AAMI). But stuff me, I didn't do anything wrong and I'm still stung with a $500 bill.

I've attached pictures, but they're pretty bad due to the phone, and the immediate rage I went through when I saw what had happened, I was probably shaking a bit.

IMAGE ONE

IMAGE TWO

MDS69 · 02-05-2015, 01:37 PM

Geeze that sux.
I know it wasn't the supermarkets fault as they have no control over their customers once they leave the premises and they will have bigger pockets than you but I wonder if they are responsible for trolleys out in the street and the issues they may cause. Talk to your local council to see if there is some weird bylaw or something covering this type of thing.

Rolkus · 02-05-2015, 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MDS69

Geeze that sux.
I know it wasn't the supermarkets fault as they have no control over their customers once they leave the premises and they will have bigger pockets than you but I wonder if they are responsible for trolleys out in the street and the issues they may cause. Talk to your local council to see if there is some weird bylaw or something covering this type of thing.

I was thinking as they haven't taken steps to prevent trolleys from leaving the property or collecting them, they MAY be liable, if they say no, it's a no simple and I'll take that on the chin.

Quote:

Originally Posted by malazn mafia

That's terrible, but thats the kind of scum who live in Wyndham/Werribee anyway... Time for a new neighbourhood perhaps?

While I am gracious of the empathy, insulting where I live and where my kids go to school isn't helping any situation.

malazn mafia · 02-05-2015, 01:39 PM

That's terrible, but thats the kind of scum who live in Wyndham/Werribee anyway... Time for a new neighbourhood perhaps?

**EASYBOSS** · 02-05-2015, 03:32 PM

Just polish out what you can and trade it in, don't even spend any more time trying to get someone to pay for it, it wont happen.

Poo happens, Karma will get the culprits one day.

devilcv8 · 02-05-2015, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EASYBOSS

Just polish out what you can and trade it in, don't even spend any more time trying to get someone to pay for it, it wont happen.

Poo happens, Karma will get the culprits one day.

This one speaks the truth.

Worst case is your trade in valuation drops. If you really want to spend money,get a painless dent remover guy to knock out those dents oboe the wheel.

BradEL · 02-05-2015, 04:53 PM

They need to have the trolley system they have in Europe, you put your 2 Euro into the coin thing and then go about your shopping and only get money back when you return trolley. Wouldnt stop all the problem but I am pretty sure it will be a very good deterrent to stop so many stray trollys.

**Giant Cranium** · 02-05-2015, 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BradEL

They need to have the trolley system they have in Europe, you put your 2 Euro into the coin thing and then go about your shopping and only get money back when you return trolley. Wouldnt stop all the problem but I am pretty sure it will be a very good deterrent to stop so many stray trollys.

have that system all over sydney.

BradEL · 02-05-2015, 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Giant Cranium

have that system all over sydney.

Oh I didn't know that mate I live in new Zealand

Franco Cozzo · 02-05-2015, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BradEL

They need to have the trolley system they have in Europe, you put your 2 Euro into the coin thing and then go about your shopping and only get money back when you return trolley. Wouldnt stop all the problem but I am pretty sure it will be a very good deterrent to stop so many stray trollys.

They have that at Aldi

commonrails · 02-05-2015, 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BradEL

They need to have the trolley system they have in Europe, you put your 2 Euro into the coin thing and then go about your shopping and only get money back when you return trolley. Wouldnt stop all the problem but I am pretty sure it will be a very good deterrent to stop so many stray trollys.

Only stops the honest people, muppets just brake the coin mechanisms and carry on as per usual. Oh and guess who indirectly pays for the broken mechanisms? us.

Ben73 · 02-05-2015, 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by commonrails

Only stops the honest people, muppets just brake the coin mechanisms and carry on as per usual. Oh and guess who indirectly pays for the broken mechanisms? us.

It does reduce the number of abandoned trolleys . I rarely see Aldi trolleys laying in the street, but always see Coles and Wollies ones.

**Ross 1** · 02-05-2015, 10:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BradEL

They need to have the trolley system they have in Europe, you put your 2 Euro into the coin thing and then go about your shopping and only get money back when you return trolley. Wouldnt stop all the problem but I am pretty sure it will be a very good deterrent to stop so many stray trollys.

The trollies at Broadway in Sydney have sensors that lock the wheels when you try and leave the shops or car park.

**EASYBOSS** · 03-05-2015, 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ross 1

The trollies at Broadway in Sydney have sensors that lock the wheels when you try and leave the shops or car park.

,

That must have been what happened, the wheels on the trolley lock up and it lost control

**Kingsley** · 02-05-2015, 04:09 PM

Funny how those shopping trolleys seem to escape the rest of the herd. We often find them grazing individually around here and we're nowhere near town....

My son had two incidents in the same carpark in two days. His car (BF XR6) was in the carpark where he works. When he finished work he found a deep 25cm gouge along the bonnet where either a white tray back 4wd or small truck had reversed into the car. No note was left....
The next day he parked it on the hill there. He came out to find a red Laser hard up against the back bumper. The new Australian who owned the Laser is the new cleaner there and doesn't speak much English at all. They had to call his wife who spoke marginally more English than he did. After much hand waving and gesturing it was explained to them that he (the husband) had left the handbrake off and the transmission out of gear and his Laser had rolled downhill into my sons damaging the rear bar. She got all upset and accused my son of leaving his handbrake off and his car mustve rolled UPHILL into the Laser......
Both instances his employer said that parking there was his risk and sort it out with your own insurance company.

XB GS 351 Coupe · 02-05-2015, 04:18 PM

Don't look to shifting the blame, it's no one fault (apart from the scum that threw the trolley), but it's your car so you wear it.

Woud not be looking at the supermarket or anyone else to blame, as they did nothing wrong, too many people complaining about trolleys may just get them to change the rules to may be the trolleys won't be allowed to leave the store in future, will be fun getting your groceries to the car then...

mik · 02-05-2015, 05:03 PM

That's unfortunate mate, it almost makes you feel like it's not worth owning anything better than a $400 dollar **** box when this stuff happens.
If your going to trade it anyway maybe have a talk to the Dealer, he might say not to worry about it, what's the worst he can say..... Fix it please.

**EASYBOSS** · 02-05-2015, 05:16 PM

And in Vic

brennan. · 03-05-2015, 09:04 AM

You'll never paintless those dents on the dog leg, maybe the one on the quarter but there's little to no access in there. $500 seems very low for that job, I'd leave it, the last thing you want is a terrible paint job when you're trying to trade it in. Better to lose on trade in value for a few scratches than say a colour match looking like Stevie Wonder has done it.

**MercurySilver** · 03-05-2015, 10:31 AM

leave it
the hassle to organize to fix it thru warranty or no warranty is not worth it imo
just clean it up best as possible and trade it in
explain what happened if need be but they will prob fix it cheaper than you can and have no trouble selling the car on

b0son · 03-05-2015, 12:02 PM

You think you're going to get a fair repair price from the trade-in dealer? I'd be sending them a pic and asking for an estimate how much they'll take off the trade rather than do nothing hoping for the best.

brennan. · 03-05-2015, 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b0son

You think you're going to get a fair repair price from the trade-in dealer? I'd be sending them a pic and asking for an estimate how much they'll take off the trade rather than do nothing hoping for the best.

Why would he be asking the dealer for a repair price? What would they know about it? He's had a quote of $500 to fix it so just take that quote to them and say take it off the trade in price. That's better than rolling up with a rough as guts $500 repair and them taking $1000 off to then fix that.

b0son · 03-05-2015, 02:55 PM

Because they don't have to take that quote? They don't even have to take the car....

brennan. · 08-05-2015, 09:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b0son

Because they don't have to take that quote? They don't even have to take the car....

Surely they want to make a sale? Mind you some yards I've been to it seems the total opposite.

b0son · 08-05-2015, 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brennan.

Surely they want to make a sale? Mind you some yards I've been to it seems the total opposite.

What does the contract say? I'm sure there's a clause re: the condition the car is to be provided in and what is to be done if it isn't as stated.

lucas2 · 03-05-2015, 03:51 PM

I think the supermarket may be held responsible. This stuff happens often. Imagine your car gets stolen and then hits another car..who's insurance pays? Most likely your insurance will. Taking the trolley out of the premises (car park) is theft. The supermarkets have insurance for this kind of thing.

XB GS 351 Coupe · 04-05-2015, 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lucas2

I think the supermarket may be held responsible. This stuff happens often. Imagine your car gets stolen and then hits another car..who's insurance pays? Most likely your insurance will. Taking the trolley out of the premises (car park) is theft. The supermarkets have insurance for this kind of thing.

Taking a trolley from a car park is not theft, how many people do you see getting charged for taking a trolley out of the car park??

Does not meet the proofs required to charge someone with theft.

lucas2 · 04-05-2015, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XB GS 351 Coupe

Taking a trolley from a car park is not theft, how many people do you see getting charged for taking a trolley out of the car park??

Does not meet the proofs required to charge someone with theft.

What is it then? So it's okay to take trolleys from the supermarket premises and not return it? I have heard of people who use small trolleys for their washing at home, is that okay? What would be the proofs required? I assume from your posts that you are/ were in law enforcement or have an affiliation with law enforcement (I have much respect for police officers)

As defined in the Victorian crimes act 1958:

" A person steals if he dishonestly appropriates property belonging to another with the intention of permanently depriving the other of it."

"A person appropriating property belonging to another without meaning the other permanently to lose the thing itself is nevertheless to be regarded as having the intention of permanently depriving the other of it if his intention is to treat the thing as his own to dispose of regardless of the other's rights; and a borrowing or lending of it may amount to so treating it if, but only if, the borrowing or lending is for a period and in circumstances making it equivalent to an outright taking or disposal."

GT0132 · 04-05-2015, 03:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lucas2

What is it then? So it's okay to take trolleys from the supermarket premises and not return it? I have heard of people who use small trolleys for their washing at home, is that okay? What would be the proofs required? I assume from your posts that you are/ were in law enforcement or have an affiliation with law enforcement (I have much respect for police officers)

As defined in the Victorian crimes act 1958:

" A person steals if he dishonestly appropriates property belonging to another with the intention of permanently depriving the other of it."

"A person appropriating property belonging to another without meaning the other permanently to lose the thing itself is nevertheless to be regarded as having the intention of permanently depriving the other of it if his intention is to treat the thing as his own to dispose of regardless of the other's rights; and a borrowing or lending of it may amount to so treating it if, but only if, the borrowing or lending is for a period and in circumstances making it equivalent to an outright taking or disposal."

There's probably a distinction that needs to be made between (1) merely, taking a trolley out of a shopping centre to load your vehicle because it happens to be parked a few blocks away(for example) and (2) taking it all the way home, with no intention of returning it. The latter being more akin to theft than the former.

XB GS 351 Coupe · 04-05-2015, 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lucas2

What is it then? So it's okay to take trolleys from the supermarket premises and not return it? I have heard of people who use small trolleys for their washing at home, is that okay? What would be the proofs required? I assume from your posts that you are/ were in law enforcement or have an affiliation with law enforcement (I have much respect for police officers)

As defined in the Victorian crimes act 1958:

" A person steals if he dishonestly appropriates property belonging to another with the intention of permanently depriving the other of it."

"A person appropriating property belonging to another without meaning the other permanently to lose the thing itself is nevertheless to be regarded as having the intention of permanently depriving the other of it if his intention is to treat the thing as his own to dispose of regardless of the other's rights; and a borrowing or lending of it may amount to so treating it if, but only if, the borrowing or lending is for a period and in circumstances making it equivalent to an outright taking or disposal."

Yep you hit the nail on the head, for someone to be charged with stealing, they must have the INTENTION or STATE OF MIND (They must have >Mens Rea< which is legal speak for guilty mind; guilty knowledge or intention to commit a prohibited act) to keep the item and/or to permanently deprive the owner of said item ie sell the item on or give it as a present or keep it or similar.

Using the trolley to take your shopping home or to your car parked down the road a bit and dumping it on the street is NOT stealing, as there is no intend to keep the item. It's not the right thing to do, but it's not stealing according to the law and/or courts.

Taking the trolley home and start using it for your washing, fire wood etc or to store stuff then it could be considered stealing it.

In similar circumstances if you lend your mate your car to go up the road to buy smokes, and he does not return it, but does a 4 week around Australia trip in it, the car is not actually stolen as you 'gave' him the car, and you would need to sue him under civil law for a breach of your agreement, but not criminally for stealing, gets very interesting with all the loop holes in the system.