Holden releases 'Redline' performance package on Series 2 SSV and Calais V

[Redrum]

That is Holden's biggest let down, their ***** auto transmission.

[flappist]

Originally Posted by bfiipursuit

Ford have tried this over the years, in the early BA days there were way more options available from factory then there are now, for the simple fact that no one bothered with them and it was too hard to get dealers to stock the right cars with the right options.

The only options the Falcon range really needs is the 4 pot brembos for the Turbos and those who want better brakes. Hell id even option brembos on an XR6 if i was going to keep it long term!

Yes but even the BA XR8 & XR6T had an upgraded brake option. I have only ever seen one of each.

Dealers almost always stock the most povvo versions as that is what sells and as most people suffer from the 21st century "I want it NOW" syndrome bugger all are prepared to wait 6 weeks for a special order.

Have you ever actually seen:
BA XR8 or 6T with upgraded brakes?
BA GT, Typhoon, Tornado or Pursuit with Brembos?
BF GT, GT40, Cobra, Typhoon, Tornado or Pursuit with 6 spot Brembos?
FG GS with Brembos?
FG GT, F6, F6 Ute or Pursuit with 6 spot Brembos?

I have seen 1 each of BA XR8 & 6T, BA Pursuit, BA Typhoon (mine) & BF Cobra and I used to actively look for them.

The standard reply (especially on here) is "They are too expensive/you don't need them".

The biggest selling FPV is povvo with stripes & decals.
The biggest selling XR6T is povvo with ZF.

*povvo means no factory options except those that are "free" as in , included in a promotion.

[FPV8U]

While i understand your point, it doesn't cost them anything to have it as an option.. specially when the brackets, lines and the brake package itself is sitting there to go on the FPV's.

[CAT600]

Originally Posted by phillyc

Quite poor economy....

13.5L/100km is not good.... but with E85 right now at 34-37cpl cheaper than 95 octane (not to mention BP98 even dearer again) thats over 25% less cost per litre so that 13.5 comes down to effectively 10L/100km which for 114 equivalent octane rated "race" fuel is not bad at all.... i'll bet that a 325kw GTS makes 340-350kw on that fuel once HSV are allowed to play.

Which is nothing compared to what FPV could achieve with the 310 T6 and the Miami brothers.

Daniel

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by FPV8U

While i understand your point, it doesn't cost them anything to have it as an option.. specially when the brackets, lines and the brake package itself is sitting there to go on the FPV's.

But it does start to erode the integrity and aspiration incentive of the higher spec models that have these options or std spec...

[Polyal]

Originally Posted by 4Vman

But it does start to erode the integrity and aspiration incentive of the higher spec models that have these options or std spec...

Does it? I thought a FPV was more than just a brake package?

I dont understand what the issue is, if the people want it give it to them or are people trying to protect FPV somehow?

A XR6T/XR8 with brembos will never be a FPV, some people for many reasons dont want to or cant step up to a FPV so what about them? Its such an easy money spinner as many people just go aftermarket. Why not capture that?

If I had the choice between a $5k package with Ford (warranted) and a $3-4k package aftermarket then I would spend the extra no worries. Makes it all even easier when all you do is tick a box.

[Romulus]

Originally Posted by flappist

Yes but even the BA XR8 & XR6T had an upgraded brake option. I have only ever seen one of each.

Dealers almost always stock the most povvo versions as that is what sells and as most people suffer from the 21st century "I want it NOW" syndrome bugger all are prepared to wait 6 weeks for a special order.

Have you ever actually seen:
BA XR8 or 6T with upgraded brakes?
BA GT, Typhoon, Tornado or Pursuit with Brembos?
BF GT, GT40, Cobra, Typhoon, Tornado or Pursuit with 6 spot Brembos?
FG GS with Brembos?
FG GT, F6, F6 Ute or Pursuit with 6 spot Brembos?

I have seen 1 each of BA XR8 & 6T, BA Pursuit, BA Typhoon (mine) & BF Cobra and I used to actively look for them.

The standard reply (especially on here) is "They are too expensive/you don't need them".

The biggest selling FPV is povvo with stripes & decals.
The biggest selling XR6T is povvo with ZF.

*povvo means no factory options except those that are "free" as in , included in a promotion.

The brake upgrade charged by FPV is drug money. Especially since the FPV's come with the 4 pot Brembo's standard (excluding the GS, it's more an XR8). At $2500-$3000 it would be a reasonable price to pay, but not in excess of $5k for the premium brakes. There's a big 2nd hand and aftermarket business in Brembo brakes for Falcons. Ring RBS or BSM or check ebay for good deals on brake packages.

I did order 'premium brakes' on my BAII XR6T back in '05. With hindsight I'd have been better off keeping the $3k and spent it on Brembo brakes.

Holden are smart offering the Brembo brakes and 19" wheels as a $2500 option. It represents good value for money and should be an option on the XR and G series Falcon's and the FPV GS.

[Romulus]

Originally Posted by 4Vman

But it does start to erode the integrity and aspiration incentive of the higher spec models that have these options or std spec...

There-in lies the problem with the GS IMO.

[FPV8U]

Originally Posted by 4Vman

But it does start to erode the integrity and aspiration incentive of the higher spec models that have these options or std spec...

Is that a Problem for Ford or FPV to worry about?

I think the S/C will have more sway than a set of brakes ever would.

[flappist]

Originally Posted by GT Falcon

The brake upgrade charged by FPV is drug money. Especially since the FPV's come with the 4 pot Brembo's standard (excluding the GS, it's more an XR8). At $2500-$3000 it would be a reasonable price to pay, but not in excess of $5k for the premium brakes. There's a big 2nd hand and aftermarket business in Brembo brakes for Falcons. Ring RBS or BSM or check ebay for good deals on brake packages.

I did order 'premium brakes' on my BAII XR6T back in '05. With hindsight I'd have been better off keeping the $3k and spent it on Brembo brakes.

Holden are smart offering the Brembo brakes and 19" wheels as a $2500 option. It represents good value for money and should be an option on the XR and G series Falcon's and the FPV GS.

Originally Posted by me

The standard reply (especially on here) is "They are too expensive/you don't need them".

Quod erat demonstrandum

[pottery beige]

aussie cars and aussie jobs if it sells more who cares... competition improves the breed......

[phillyc]

Originally Posted by CAT600

13.5L/100km is not good.... but with E85 right now at 34-37cpl cheaper than 95 octane (not to mention BP98 even dearer again) thats over 25% less cost per litre so that 13.5 comes down to effectively 10L/100km which for 114 equivalent octane rated "race" fuel is not bad at all.... i'll bet that a 325kw GTS makes 340-350kw on that fuel once HSV are allowed to play.

Which is nothing compared to what FPV could achieve with the 310 T6 and the Miami brothers.

Daniel

Hey I look forward to E85. Just that Caltex is talking 100cpl versus 135cpl for 98RON. I accept that an extra 25% consumption is the accepted penalty. So, your still about 10% in front compared to a regular GTS.

What I don't accept is the 13.5L/100km on a cruisy country drive when there are enough members on here with F6 which flog stock versus stock HSV GTS and use much less fuel on an equivalent basis.

I'm also expecting that a S/C Miami GS/GT will be decent on fuel too whilst handing it to the GTS as well.

[Brazen]

Heard the redline package is $1500 option as an introductory offer and will revert to $2500 sometime in the future. Its also available on the Calais V Sportwagon, something the media didnt really spell out. At $1500 its a no-brainer.

[Romulus]

Originally Posted by flappist

Quod erat demonstrandum

Agree and disagree. Yes it's too expensive because it should be priced at a more realistic level. Not a blatant rip-off price.

[tweeked]

The option game only works with easy dealer fit items.

Most people (ie, not true enthusiasts we have here), will bypass these options when they can buy a car off the floor or have it transferred from other stock in a day or two.

To wait for a dealer to order bits and peices and wait for them to be fitted, or worse still wait for a car to be scheduled and built to order on the line is too much for them.

[Stoney!]

Originally Posted by Iggypoppin'

Big? Fpv's engine is 1litre smaller. I'd prefer the more advanced super charged engine over the bigger pushrod Holden motor. bring on quadcams!

Yeah... lol. That more 'advanced' DOHC small block super charged unit that only manages 10kw and 10nm more than the aincient pushrod 6.2 from HSV. Even worse only manages to save 0.2L/100k's, and thats with fords better gearbox too.....

Sure it will blitz the 6.2 with its flatter tourqe curve, but I think they could have done much much better.

Holden aren't worried I don't think, it won't come close to swaying them from number 1 sales and they got their new motor on the horizon, also small block charged, but with DI also. Not to mention better over all package in the Holdens with better standard equipment.

Well done to Holden for the real reason they are doing this, giving the customers what they want.

Stoney!

[Romulus]

Even with the "better over all package in the Holdens with better standard equipment" HSV or Holden still couldn't convince me to even contemplate looking at their product. The bogan stigma doesn't sit well with me.

On the contrary, I don't think Ford and FPV have anything to worry about knowing the type of product HSV release.

[Stoney!]

You don't think both cars have a Bogan stigma????? Any car maker that makes something with reasonable power that's worth nothing in 8 - 10 years time will have bogan's driving it. Lately though Bogans seem to be buying more korean cars these days. Bogans don't have enough money for new cars cause they are all on the dole so you can forget that..... Just a lame one eyed excuse.

Stoney!

[b2tf]

Originally Posted by spvd02

They're not just giving the customers what they want. They're desperate, and because their V8 will be inferior to FPV V8's, they're trying to take the focus away from the engine and make it look like they have the better 'complete package'.

In reality, though, FPV will still offer a great package, and it's not all about the engine. Sure, that's the only thing people are talking about, but it doesn't automatically mean the rest of the car is sub-par.

Redline looks like a good package, but it's one they wouldn't have come up with were it not for FPV's new offering.

I believe the word you are looking for is 'competition' and it is quite possibly the best thing that a consumer can find in any marketplace - not just cars.

Put the scepticism and one eyed brand loyalty aside for a minute and have a look at what is going on here - Ford/FPV are bringing out some awesome cars, Holden/HSV are doing so too. They dont all have new bits and pieces but I seem to remember FPV launching the FG range with carryover BF wheels and maybe according to your logic it was because they were 'desperate'.

Name any other country in the world where you can buy a RWD V8 with as many options, inclusions , safety additions and whatever else for the same price we do in Australia. Bet you can't.

Regardless of where the parts come from, be it a failed export program or a lot of leftover stuff, the fact is that they are much better being available on cars than sitting in a spare parts warehouse - and unless you have been hiding under a rock somewhere you would know that customers love options. I dont like having the exact same car as anybody else - thats why I option things on it and modify it with aftermarket stuff. If I can put more fruit on it from factory, and have a better overall car, then I'm certainly going to do it. And since it's an option, the bloke behind me who buys the same car I do, doesnt have to have the same things I do on my car. Thats an ideal setup.

[b2tf]

Originally Posted by GT Falcon

Even with the "better over all package in the Holdens with better standard equipment" HSV or Holden still couldn't convince me to even contemplate looking at their product. The bogan stigma doesn't sit well with me.

Yeah cos Kmart don't sell Fors branded stuff to bogans do they......

[DJM83]

Originally Posted by b2tf

I believe the word you are looking for is 'competition' and it is quite possibly the best thing that a consumer can find in any marketplace - not just cars.

Put the scepticism and one eyed brand loyalty aside for a minute and have a look at what is going on here - Ford/FPV are bringing out some awesome cars, Holden/HSV are doing so too. They dont all have new bits and pieces but I seem to remember FPV launching the FG range with carryover BF wheels and maybe according to your logic it was because they were 'desperate'.

Name any other country in the world where you can buy a RWD V8 with as many options, inclusions , safety additions and whatever else for the same price we do in Australia. Bet you can't.

Regardless of where the parts come from, be it a failed export program or a lot of leftover stuff, the fact is that they are much better being available on cars than sitting in a spare parts warehouse - and unless you have been hiding under a rock somewhere you would know that customers love options. I dont like having the exact same car as anybody else - thats why I option things on it and modify it with aftermarket stuff. If I can put more fruit on it from factory, and have a better overall car, then I'm certainly going to do it. And since it's an option, the bloke behind me who buys the same car I do, doesnt have to have the same things I do on my car. Thats an ideal setup.

Spot on Aust, BUT for the amount of new cars sold people like you (and me) and a few people on this site that are enthousiasts that would option cars with a few goodies to make it that little bit different there would be 20-30 people there that will buy a 'standard' car so making the viablility of offering something likes brakes a pointless exercise i guess. But yes it does give them the option to move the parts covered in cobwebs in the corner. Adding to that most people that option something like brakes are smart enough to know that when they are stuffed Ford/GM wont be putting their factory replacements on when its due the owner will buy aftermarket so the company really only gets the original outlay for the brakes over a standard car.

[pottery beige]

Originally Posted by Stoney!

You don't think both cars have a Bogan stigma????? Any car maker that makes something with reasonable power that's worth nothing in 8 - 10 years time will have bogan's driving it. Lately though Bogans seem to be buying more korean cars these days. Bogans don't have enough money for new cars cause they are all on the dole so you can forget that..... Just a lame one eyed excuse.

Stoney!

hey wicked im a ford driving bogan.. love getting around in me flanno and double pluggers... get some looks up the servo sunday paper run when the JG33 pulls up out jumps mr beanie trackys socks n thongs.....

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by b2tf

Name any other country in the world where you can buy a RWD V8 with as many options, inclusions , safety additions and whatever else for the same price we do in Australia. Bet you can't.

America?

I've come to the conclusion that FPV limited the power of the new Coyote, because the gearbox wouldn't handle that much torque?

Chuck in an Alison 6 speed

[DJM83]

Originally Posted by Stoney!

Yeah... lol. That more 'advanced' DOHC small block super charged unit that only manages 10kw and 10nm more than the aincient pushrod 6.2 from HSV. Even worse only manages to save 0.2L/100k's, and thats with fords better gearbox too.....

Yeah as if ford are going to bring the engine into play with max power output on the table from day 1

Originally Posted by Stoney!

Sure it will blitz the 6.2 with its flatter tourqe curve, but I think they could have done much much better.

As above

Originally Posted by Stoney!

Holden aren't worried I don't think, it won't come close to swaying them from number 1 sales and they got their new motor on the horizon, also small block charged, but with DI also. Not to mention better over all package in the Holdens with better standard equipment.

Holden not worried why should they be the SC 5.0 is an FPV vehicle not Ford so it isnt any competition
Holden are worried about their ancient pushrod V8 so they are trying to round off their 'package' to compensate by offering brake packages

Originally Posted by Stoney!

Well done to Holden for the real reason they are doing this, giving the customers what they want.Stoney!

Yeah right, lets see how many buyers take up the option of this package, Ford tried it and it never worked this will be like

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by DJM83

Yeah right, lets see how many buyers take up the option of this package, Ford tried it and it never worked this will be like

Ford and Holden customers are different though.

[DJM83]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

Ford and Holden customers are different though.

The only way they are different IMO is brand 'tribalisim' thats it, i dont see anyone swapping camps for some brakes

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by DJM83

The only way they are different IMO is brand 'tribalisim' thats it, i dont see anyone swapping camps for some brakes

I don't either, but the way I took your post was you meant that no one would option up the brakes packages etc.

[DJM83]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

I don't either, but the way I took your post was you meant that no one would option up the brakes packages etc.

Thats what i meant, yeah some people will IMO i reckon about 20% at best so i hardly see it worth while for Holden

[flappist]

Originally Posted by b2tf

Name any other country in the world where you can buy a RWD V8 with as many options, inclusions , safety additions and whatever else for the same price we do in Australia. Bet you can't.

USA
Canada
Mexico
New Zealand
Germany

Basically everywhere really.

[galaxy xr8]

Originally Posted by flappist

USA
Canada
Mexico
New Zealand
Germany

Basically everywhere really.

You forgot Tasmania.