Must all Car Salesmen graduate from @%$hole school?

Crazy Dazz · 30-05-2016, 11:25 PM

Yes, I am once again in the market for a car, and once again hating the encounters.

I'd be seriously interested in hearing from any members who are actually car salespeople.

I honestly cannot understand the mentality of your entire industry.
I can go to Woolies to buy a pint of milk, and the gormless pimply 15yr old, on minimum wage, will smile, say hello, and treat me with courtesy. Presumably they have been trained to do this, and presumably at some point somebody has explained to them that "manners cost nothing."

Anybody in business that involves any form of customer service has learnt that not only do manners cost nothing, but you get more bees with honey, assorted other cliches, and at least knows that unless you hold a monopoly on an essential product, treating people with respect is invariably good for business.

So how have these lessons completely bypassed the motor industry?
I'd seriously like to know if being a rude, abusive, @%$hole has ever clinched the sale for you?

For starters, I am ****ed that I even have to be involved in this process.
The cars I'm looking at, are pos with iPhone docks and 7yr warranties. The manufacturer has invested their future in marketing cars to females, on the clear understanding that ladies are the majority buyer of these products.
So why are car yards still patrolled by club-wielding Neanderthals in loin-clothes, sniffing their own armpits?
My daughter, who is 24 years old and currently completing her Masters in Clinical Psychology, has been treated with such rudeness and disrespect that she refuses to visit car yards or talk to salesmen.

Even salesmen who start out chummy, eventually revert to rude, @%$hole type behaviour. Refusing to answer even SIMPLE questions.
We're looking for a sedan, simple. No messing anyone about.
The ad clearly states that it's a sedan. The photo (which is not always of the actual car) clearly shows a hatch. Is it really so difficult to tell me which it is?
Another states "You pay only $15,000 (with $3,000 'minimum trade-in')." Is it really that flaming unreasonable to enquire as to the price without any trade?
A new car is $19k drive-away. You have a 2 year old car with 30,000kms advertised for the same price. Am I really being such a "time-waster" enquiring if your price is the least bit flexible?

Phildo · 31-05-2016, 12:40 AM

www.pickles.com.au

www.manheim.com.au

Buy where the dealers get their cars from.

The car market in Perth is also crap right now. Dealers are selling way less than they used to.

Still, no excuse for letting desperation get in the way of things.

Quite the opposite - tell the girl that your income is crap at the moment, and you'll do whatever you can to flog her a car.

Get her into the office. Get a tea/coffee/whatever. Ask questions about what she's after, take some notes and then go find something suitable. ie be her "car broker"

Honesty has its moments.

Ben73 · 31-05-2016, 01:34 AM

Can't say I have had too many that are rude, but a lot seam to talk ****. Usually by showing you stuff you are not interested in or changing the subject when you ask a question they don't want to answer.

tonys6550 · 31-05-2016, 02:20 AM

It's certainly a draining experience isn't it hahaha

I'm told there are good sales-people out there.......somewhere

Good luck with it all.

Stefan · 31-05-2016, 06:50 AM

Don't rely on the salesman at all, you said in an earlier thread you don't care how it drives, you just warranty.

By the time I walk into a car yard I know what I want and know the car that I'm there to see and price i'm willing to pay for it. I just need to look at it and confirm service history, condition or whatever.

Inspect it, drive it, make an offer or move on. Don't ask many questions you get less BS.

SumoDog68 · 31-05-2016, 08:23 AM

Interesting situation - you would think that someone with a degree in Psychology would be prepared for their antics. Car salesmen are not that hard to work with and ultimately if you don't like them or their product - it is easy to walk away (apart from time wasting while doing that). If you think that their product is pos they might sense that and react accordingly.
I am not a big fan of dealing with them but my rules are - treat them with respect, do your research and don't look for their opinions ,suggestions. Test drive as many cars in category as you can - once you have decided on the car get the deal .
Find out what good price is (forums are good source of info) , make them an offer . Asking if they are flexible on a price is not how to do it. Make an offer and you will find out how flexible they are , if you are not committed to buying don't talk price .
Last car we bought , salesman did not have to say anything (maybe 3 short sentences in total). I test drove the car , knew all about it and made an offer which was accepted after some ceremonial bargaining.

Craig@AUDI · 31-05-2016, 09:06 AM

For all the nighmares you've dealth with, there's an equal amount of them as customers too!

Both parties can make a transaction harder than it needs to be.

falconhell74 · 31-05-2016, 09:14 AM

the other way to do it is to tell the sales man that you are after a small car with this that and the other etc you are willing to pay up to X amount , what do you have?

mike_nofx · 31-05-2016, 09:22 AM

I don't have a great deal of experience with sales people but I have heard quite a few stories of how being rude is an effective deal sealer.

A mate just sold his house and the sales lady he got from this particular real estate agent is a known rude ******. BUT she also makes the most sales. My mate found her a little difficult to deal with but she sold the house fast and for a good price.

Another person I know sells campervans, he attends the camping shows and gets the usual tyre kickers, people who are probably playing the role of the uninterested buyer to try get a better price. He will use lines like "If you're not going to buy one, move on, I'm busy here", Its amazing how many people get their wallet out and place an order after being talked to like that.

No idea why it works, but it seems like it just does. Possibly because most people are sheep and need to be told what to do, those that dislike that treatment just walk away. Its often the older sales people who are the rudest, those in the industry for 30+ years, surely by now they know what works, and if they're rude and still employed for that long, well it must work.

Pedro · 31-05-2016, 09:24 AM

Craig is on the money.
I have been in sales for most of my working life, selling cars, real estate, business systems, jewellery, etc.. There are different selling disciplines, depending on what you are selling.
In the case of car sales, a prospect walks onto your lot and you have to work hard and fast to capture the sale, because this is your only chance. If the prospect walks ... there goes part of your pay cheque. So car sales people go for the close from the opening dialog and sometimes this can seem/be aggressive, depending on the expertise of the salesperson.

JAJH · 31-05-2016, 09:41 AM

I, too have been in the sales game for 30 years and I think a good percentage of the public have it backwards. The media has instilled the idea into the public to "shop around, do your homework, get quotes, blah, blah, blah". But what they don't realize is the amount of the salespersons'/company time they waste by doing so and this has a knock on effect on the cost of the service or goods, and in turn the salesperson will naturally become wary of the tyre kicker. Not very person who walks into a caryard or retailer is there to buy. Some people will just wander in for a look and either ignore the salesperson or just take up their time with no intention of buying. If you treat the salesperson with disinterest/disrespect you cant really expect to be treated any different. The customer who demands a discount or a better deal will rarely get one from me, yet the customer who is polite, engages in conversation and doesn't demand anything will usually get the best deal because they don't ask or expect it. It's always a 2 way street when dealing with people.
I have always been a critic and advocate for the salesperson and remember a quote a famous person said years ago, "if the salespeople of the world went on strike tomorrow, the world's economy would collapse in a week". It might sound a bit over-dramatic but nothing in the world gets bought if someone didn't sell it first.

**Dave R** · 31-05-2016, 10:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JAJH

If you treat the salesperson with disinterest/disrespect you cant really expect to be treated any different.

While I imagine much of the work is commission based, I'd still expect a salesperson to remain polite and respectful because they're being paid a base salary to do exactly that. In this case they're not just representing a dealership or franchise, they're representing a brand that's much bigger than them. I bet it probably gets tiring, but I also think that's part of the job, no? Speaking of Ford in particular, it seems they're perhaps misidentifying tyre kickers regularly with some of the stories going around. I've bought 2 new cars so far this year and I must say, Ford was a truly horrible experience across the few dealers that I visited. You wouldn't think that a salesman could be clueless about the product and arrogant at the same time, but they manage to pull it off.

JAJH · 31-05-2016, 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adrenaline

While I imagine much of the work is commission based, I'd still expect a salesperson to remain polite and respectful because they're being paid a base salary to do exactly that. In this case they're not just representing a dealership or franchise, they're representing a brand that's much bigger than them. I bet it probably gets tiring, but I also think that's part of the job, no? Speaking of Ford in particular, it seems they're perhaps misidentifying tyre kickers regularly with some of the stories going around. I've bought 2 new cars so far this year and I must say, Ford was a truly horrible experience across the few dealers that I visited. You wouldn't think that a salesman could be clueless about the product and arrogant at the same time, but they manage to pull it off.

Agreed, that's why in my OP I stated I am a critic and advocate of salespeople because many times I have dealt with a salesperson and it astounds me either the lack of sales/product training or the complete disinterest on their part. I have bought many cars over the years and for most I didn't have too much of a problem with the process, it's all about how you deal with the salesperson. If I get a douche I move on till I get a decent one and deal with him/her.

NX74205 · 31-05-2016, 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mike_nofx

I don't have a great deal of experience with sales people but I have heard quite a few stories of how being rude is an effective deal sealer.

That depends on the customer. It wouldn't work with me, for instance, I'd just walk away and vow never to come back. Same with pushy salespeople.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JAJH

the customer who is polite, engages in conversation and doesn't demand anything will usually get the best deal because they don't ask or expect it. It's always a 2 way street when dealing with people.

Perhaps I'm just naïve, but that's the way I look at it too. I don't treat people like crap unless they give me a reason to do so.

I recently bought a car and the experience couldn't have been more pleasant. I couldn't possibly have asked for better service from the salesperson I got. He went above and beyond and did everything I asked for to make me happy. It took me several months and several test drives in different conditions before I actually signed, and during that time, not once did I feel I was being pushed into the deal.

There are good salespeople out there. Unfortunately, the bad ones tarnish the reputation of the industry as a whole.

falconhell74 · 31-05-2016, 11:41 AM

there are still some good salesmen out there , when I moved to Gladstone QLD I needed a second run around , I went to a couple of used car mobs and found a good one . I explained to the owner as it was a small used car lot that I was looking for a car no more than $1500.00 preferably a ford did he have anything .
He didn't at the time but said he regularly goes to all the other dealer ships in town and gets their trade ins for his business and he would let me know if he found anything to suit.
A couple of days later he rang me and told me he had a EB falcon in decent nick for $1000,00 .
I went and had a look , one owner with books pretty dam immaculate only issue was hood lining falling down .
He said if I wanted it to go to the ford dealership and to pay XXXXXX salesman there as he wasn't about to make any thing on the deal.
Needless to say I sent 2 other friends to him when they were looking for cars and he got 2 more sales from being a stand up guy.

mike_nofx · 31-05-2016, 11:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JAJH

"if the salespeople of the world went on strike tomorrow, the world's economy would collapse in a week". It might sound a bit over-dramatic but nothing in the world gets bought if someone didn't sell it first.

But this will never happen. However, buyers go on "strike" and things like GFC happen.

danzvtil · 31-05-2016, 12:06 PM

I don't get the "im busy" entitlement coming from some sales people. You are in CUSTOMER SERVICE, talk to people and connect with them. Buying a car is a big deal for most people, so what if a prospect comes in and chews your ear 3 times before signing. Those 3 interactions were probably what made the customer comfortable enough to deal with you (or not).
I bought my rio from a dealer across town because I dropped in and had a chat with the sales guy 18 months earlier, he got a customer and not a sale on the day.
I too am in sales, I think sales training can confuse, having 30 seconds to make an impression with you have 30 seconds to close a deal.
My approach is to NOT sell the prospect anything in the first 5 mins of contact, just shoot the breeze, so they feel comfortable, its not rocket science.

snopony · 31-05-2016, 12:07 PM

I hate going into caryards now. My first and only run in was with an ageing salesman when I enquired about a dual cab. There were no niceties just "what would a girl like you want with a ute?" not that anyone needs a reason but to tow a horse float? soooo the nice man at Toyota sold me a Landcruiser ute and the next two times I bought from the dealership I made sure it wasnt oldmate, but one of his other salespeople. just BLAH.

NX74205 · 31-05-2016, 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by danzvtil

I don't get the "im busy" entitlement coming from some sales people. You are in CUSTOMER SERVICE, talk to people and connect with them.

Perhaps the car sales industry needs to be reformed so that a salesperson's performance is not judged on whether or not they meet or exceed their monthly quotas but on their customer service skills. That way, it frees them up focus on the customer rather than the sale.

mechanic · 31-05-2016, 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ben73

Can't say I have had too many that are rude, but a lot seam to talk ****. Usually by showing you stuff you are not interested in or changing the subject when you ask a question they don't want to answer.

That is so true.
I approached a car salesman, he listened to us for about a 10 seconds then made the statement " I know exactly the car you want", really?
Last car I bought from a car dealer, I had researched the s--t out of it online before going to have a look. The salesperson was a young lady and she was extremely pleasant to us and offered a good trade in price so we bought the vehicle.
Being employed by the same business as the salespeople has allowed me to get to know these guys away from their work. They're the same mix of good and bad as the rest of society in IMHO.

stevethepom · 31-05-2016, 02:46 PM

I have come across quite a few Arthur Daley types both here and in the UK where i am originally from who seem to think that its ok to bulls**t a potential customer because they thing they are all gullible ! It doesn't work with me as I used to work in a new vehicle inspection /transit damage repair center in the UK for 15 yrs prior to moving to Aus so have a good eye for spotting when repairs have been done to panels /paintwork etc , I had one bloke try to convince me recently that a car I was looking at had no repairs and was all original until i pointed out differences in the colours on at least 3 of the panels plus the masking lines in the door shuts and also the fact that the underside of the bonnet was finished in the same glossy finish as the exterior of the vehicle ! His reaction "well arent you a smartarse you might as well ****** off now coz there wont be anything in this yard that will meet your standards !

drz250 · 31-05-2016, 02:50 PM

Still not as painful as shopping for a used trail bike though.

Hemihunter · 31-05-2016, 02:57 PM

to all the car sales guys - CUSTOMER IS ALWAYS RIGHT !! EVEN IF THEY ARE WRONG

blackf6 · 31-05-2016, 03:17 PM

Never had a drama. Thongs, flanno. Stubbie, Winnie blue. What's that one go like? Rip a skid. Easy as.

BENT_8 · 31-05-2016, 03:53 PM

Ol' mate across the road has become a car salesman with a large Franchise here in Adelaide.
He was a good bloke when i met him, been selling cars for 6 months now, didnt take long to become an arrogant, self believing twat.
I told him it would happen, seen it many times, he doesnt even realise.

6 months ago he had no idea about cars in general, used to ask me for advice, now, rattles off irrelevant salesman BS on a whim.

Good for a bit of early mail, thats all.

sprintman1 · 31-05-2016, 04:09 PM

Biggest ********* I've met period are car buyers. I no longer sell vehicles because of them.

snowcone · 31-05-2016, 04:38 PM

I'll never waste my time in a car yard again.
They played the old, "I'll have to check with my manager" routine several times when I tried to talk money and then did the same thing at another yard with getting a trade in price. "I'll have to ring around and get a whole sale price on it". And then come back and say "it's not worth much to us".
If you don't know what the trade in is worth or how much you can sell the car for, then you are in the wrong job!
Go to the auctions - at most of them you can buy before they even go up for auction if you find one you love.

sprintman1 · 31-05-2016, 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by snowcone

I'll never waste my time in a car yard again.
They played the old, "I'll have to check with my manager" routine several times when I tried to talk money and then did the same thing at another yard with getting a trade in price. "I'll have to ring around and get a whole sale price on it". And then come back and say "it's not worth much to us".
If you don't know what the trade in is worth or how much you can sell the car for, then you are in the wrong job!
Go to the auctions - at most of them you can buy before they even go up for auction if you find one you love.

He was telling the truth. If your trade is a POS and unsuitable for sale on a decent yard for any of a multitude of reasons (no books etc) then he needs a price from a wholesaler and that can change daily. Add in the fact everybody thinks their trade is worth more than it is and You can see what happens.

Adamz Ghia · 31-05-2016, 05:31 PM

I took my sister to Weribee Mazda last Saturday and the salesman there did not have a clue. Honestly I don't know how he would ever sell a car. We told him we're not buying today as this is our first stop but that didn't stop him trying to flog us a today only offer more than 10 times. Then after my sister said she wanted to save a bit more of a deposit which would take her about a month he asked her why the hell she would want to do that when he could give her a good price today, as when she said she would be selling her car privately he said that was a silly idea as she would get more trading it in. And after we said we'd be going to Nissan, Honda and Ford he laughed in our faces and started bagging the life out of them and asked why would be even bother going.

In my time in sales I never once bagged the opposition product, if the product you're selling is good enough you don't have to.

I'd hate to think how he would have been if I wasn't with her, this is her first time buying a new car, the idiot left her flustered and really took the excitement out of it for her.

Eaturbo · 31-05-2016, 06:25 PM

Salesmans attitude and service is a direct reflection of the new car sales manager. I worked with 12 other salesman at a Holden Dealership and we were all good at our job. The manager should be keeping an eye on his team and dealing with complaints. If the manager accepts being rude and unprofessional than the sales guys will run with that. This is not always the case as the individual salesperson can be very good or very bad no matter what the managers like but a very good manager will usually have a good team under him and weed out the rubbish.