VE- Smaller and lighter?

Bossxr8 · 24-11-2005, 07:40 PM

In the latest Wheels magazine they have spy photos of the VE taken at GM's proving ground in the US. In the accompanying article they claim the VE will be slightly smaller externally, with a longer wheelbase for more interior room, and they say it will be lighter in weight. If it is actually lighter than VZ than Ford may have a big problem. Maybe the rumours of the extra weight are false. Holden have had the option of designing weight out of them due to it being a clean sheet design, Ford didn't have that option with the BA upgrade as they were stuck with an existing platform. They won't have the option to design weight out till their next clean sheet design in 2008. Does anyone have an info on weight of VE.

Smoked · 24-11-2005, 07:55 PM

Cars as a gerneral trend are gettnig heavier as more and more options are designed into them. I find it extremely difficult to believe that its a longer wheelbase and lighter.

ED Classic · 24-11-2005, 07:59 PM

GM's Proving ground? They might have to sell that one soon

Seriously though Ford will be mad if they continue to push the next Falcon towards the 2 Ton mark. Lighter {done using higher tech materials and built smarter} is the only way to go from now on. Fuel effeciancy is a high priority for alot of large car buyers now let alone when prices get to $2 a litre in the next five years. BF was a good move. When the 6 Auto becomes std on BF2 it will be another good move.

T3ts50 · 24-11-2005, 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Smoked

Cars as a gerneral trend are gettnig heavier as more and more options are designed into them. I find it extremely difficult to believe that its a longer wheelbase and lighter.

Not necassarily true, Jags, Bemmers and Mercs have all gotten lighter, but have always added extra equipment. But in Holdens case, they would most likely be heavier unless they are using alloy panels.

4Vman · 24-11-2005, 08:02 PM

If you look at euro saloons as an example they've continued to gain weight model after model as more safety systems are engineered into them as well as stiffer safer (heavier) chassis's.

flavze · 24-11-2005, 08:22 PM

They may be lighter now, but i know for a fact that in the early stages of development they were having trouble getting it down to an "acceptable" weight, whatever that is.

Bossxr8 · 24-11-2005, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

If you look at euro saloons as an example they've continued to gain weight model after model as more safety systems are engineered into them as well as stiffer safer (heavier) chassis's.

The latest 3 and 5 series BMW's were lighter than the previous models, but it required huge amounts of alloy panels and suspension components to do it, which all add significantly to costs.

I remember hearing somewhere the VE may have plastic guards to save weight.

Psycho Chicken · 24-11-2005, 08:27 PM

Ahem. XD Falcon vs VB Commo. One was a crap load bigger. It also had better economy.

I saw the cover of Wheels, it's a bloody Vectra! I really don't think it's the VE, though time will tell.

T3ts50 · 24-11-2005, 10:46 PM

Holden always give previews of their next car in their concepts for example the Cross 8 before the VY came out.. I think wheels have got it nearly spot on, before the VY came out they had artist impressions which looked exactly the same as the VY. It looks pretty much like a bigger torana.

Fairlane · 24-11-2005, 11:14 PM

I can't see how the VE could be lighter than the VZ in any way at all. Whilst I think wheels has got the styling right (not that i like, not enough glass for me), ill wager that the VE will be nearing 1700kg possibly more. Really the VE (and the zeta platform) has to be aiming for a 5 star NCAP rating this comined with the more advanced IRS and all the new elecotrnic gizmo's i cant see it being lighter than the VZ.

That being said, ill probably bet that it will be lighter than the BF.

MAD · 24-11-2005, 11:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

Holden have had the option of designing weight out of them due to it being a clean sheet design, Ford didn't have that option with the BA upgrade as they were stuck with an existing platform.

True that ford had a platform to work from but there was a lot of extra weight added due to the fact the chassis was made 88% stiffer than the AU, which was for both handling and extra body rigidity for safety.

gtfpv · 25-11-2005, 01:43 AM

mate i read in a mag that it is rumoured to have carbon fiber fromt gaurds.so thier . obviously effort going into wieght reduction.

Steffo · 25-11-2005, 01:46 AM

I wouldn't be too fussed about comparing the VE to the BF. The BF is at the end of its generation, much like EL was when the VT came out etc.

There will be an all-new Falcon in 2008, new generation, starting with a clean-sheet. I'll bet that will give Ford a chance to address the BA/BF's main issues, one of them being excessive weight. We'll see what happens then.

dddd · 25-11-2005, 11:51 AM

I think you should read the article again , it does not say lighter than vz.

zetec · 25-11-2005, 11:54 AM

I'm also surprised nobody has mentioned the IRS expected to weigh down the bum somewhat, the first thing on their menb should be turfing out the aged multilink rubbish in there now. That should lead to a weight increase from a more complex rear IRS.

MADDER · 25-11-2005, 12:12 PM

I, for one, am doing my bit to redesign VE bits at the tooling stage, discreetly adding weight wherever possible. I wanna see a heavy pig of a Commie.

Praise the Lard!

Bossxr8 · 27-11-2005, 12:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dddd

I think you should read the article again , it does not say lighter than vz.

On one of the photos it has a caption that says smaller and lighter.

Ghiadude · 27-11-2005, 01:26 PM

I said it before and ill say it again... the torana IS VE commo....look for a car that doesnt weigh more than VZ but has more in it....5.3l engine is my other less likely crystal ball item...MARK MY WORDS!!! it will NOT be much heavier than VZ

XplosiveR6 · 27-11-2005, 01:38 PM

does this mean that holden are going back to the medium car days like back in the 1980's? thats a deathwish, look how much touble that got holden into back then. Might mean falcon will be the only family sized australian car again.

Lukeyson · 27-11-2005, 02:43 PM

pffff wheels, did you see in the back where they review past issues, and they showed the cover of a 95 wheels mag, showing their prediction of the VT ?

bathurst77 · 27-11-2005, 03:23 PM

The computer versions are pretty poor renditions.
Check out the door opening shape and C pillar in the main pic on page 18 (nice slim striaght pilar nicely shaped door and rear quater window)
and and compare to the actual camo pic belw it. Fat fillar almost straight door opening, wide metala round the curvey door, more liek current commy.
Same with the bottom of A pillar and bonnet jion. The computer version looks heaps beter then theactual camoflage car.

smoo · 27-11-2005, 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EF_Dave

does this mean that holden are going back to the medium car days like back in the 1980's? thats a deathwish, look how much touble that got holden into back then. Might mean falcon will be the only family sized australian car again.

Might not be bad news for Holden considering large car sales aren't the greatest, and they wont be getting any better if gas prices go up again.

Does anyone have some scans?

dddd · 27-11-2005, 03:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

On one of the photos it has a caption that says smaller and lighter.

Smaller and lighter than the statesman they are currently putting the 2.8 v6 in for export

Bossxr8 · 28-11-2005, 01:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dddd

Smaller and lighter than the statesman they are currently putting the 2.8 v6 in for export

You may be right.

Bossxr8 · 28-11-2005, 01:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bathurst77

The computer versions are pretty poor renditions.
Check out the door opening shape and C pillar in the main pic on page 18 (nice slim striaght pilar nicely shaped door and rear quater window)
and and compare to the actual camo pic belw it. Fat fillar almost straight door opening, wide metala round the curvey door, more liek current commy.
Same with the bottom of A pillar and bonnet jion. The computer version looks heaps beter then theactual camoflage car.

I hate the way they go on about how good it looks in the article, for fcks sake they haven't even seen what it will really look like yet, its only a few crappy computer renderings. To me it looks like a ripoff of a Vectra with the rear end of the Subaru Liberty. Dull.