Issues with Ford Dealer after recent purchase.

Yellow_Festiva · 02-02-2011, 05:40 PM

Hello,

I would like some advice. As of yesterday I'm the owner of a LV Ford Focus Diesel. It was purchased off a lot owned by Ford (the used cars branch of the dealership) and was a Ford Employee car (Ford is the original owner).

The car has just under 9,000km on the clock.

Anyway, at the time of inspection and negotiation several things were mentioned / promised that obviously sweetened the deal. Enough for me to leave a deposit then collect the car after paying in full yesterday.

Unfortunately, the original sales person was not there during collection, however his boss (I assume) handled the delivery in a rushed manner.

I have had the night to think about it and am debating if I should pursue the matter. The car has been mis-represented and many items promised were not delivered on, or were, but in a watered down manner not reflecting the original discussions with the salesperson doing the deal.

This has resulted in me having to be further put of pocket and limited during the ownership of the car (servicing) and I have also found damage to a bumper that wasn't there last week during my initial inspection (promised to be repaired). An accessory was also fitted by them and the colour matching is obviously wrong.

Where to form here? I do not want to 'name and shame' anyone, however I know that If I 'let it go' I will regret not following it up straight away.

I know I'm already behind the 8 ball seeing as most of it was verbal, but I know what I asked, and I know what I heard and most of it wasn't delivered as promised.

I'm guessing the way to handle this is to contact the dealer principal, then Ford head office then what ever governing body is in charge (ACCC?).

Has anyone else had this sort of problem in the past? How did you go about getting a solution to the problem and by what means was this achieved?

I will not mention the dealer at this point in time, nor will I go into detail as to what was said. Rest assured that I was lied to on several matters and it has left a sour taste in my mouth after 2 days of ownership.

Thank you for any input on this matter,

Jason.

vman · 02-02-2011, 05:44 PM

contact the dealership and speak with the person who sold you the car.
end

Smoke Pursuit · 02-02-2011, 06:08 PM

Yes go back and talk to the guy who sold you the car and discuss it with him and his manager. If no luck then tell them to give you your money back and give them the car.

If you dont have any luck with either of them write a letter to the dealer principle outlining your concerns in WRITING, noting everything!!

Cheers.

05_ENFORCER · 02-02-2011, 06:13 PM

Isn't there a "cooling off" period when buying a vehicle from a dealer?

.

Smoke Pursuit · 02-02-2011, 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 05_ENFORCER

Isn't there a "cooling off" period when buying a vehicle from a dealer?

.

Depends on state but in Qld its 1 day, or 7 days if they dont give you a cooling off Period Form 37A to sign.

dannyhilton · 02-02-2011, 06:24 PM

http://www.fairtrading.qld.gov.au/ca...-consumers.htm

Think your cooling off period has been and gone. But as others have said, before thinking about canning the order, check with the sales staff member who sold you the car. If those talks don't progress to your liking, ask for your despot back. Hopefully talks will iron out any confusion, but if so don't hesitate to jump about. As with any deal, it's so important to get it in writing.

Good luck, and hopefully you end up getting what's yours, that LV Focus in the condition you agreed to!

Yellow_Festiva · 02-02-2011, 06:30 PM

Would rather not hand the car back to be honest. If they come good on most of what was promised I would be satisfied and life goes on.

Thank you for the input so far. I know the first step will be a meeting. I also know that it will end up in a slinging match of what was and wasn't said. I was alone during negotiations and inspection but as stated I know I was lied to and I look forward to hearing from people who may have been in a similar situation and the outcome.

I will type a draft letter of what my issues are while they are vivid in my mind and keep it should it be needed.

Cheers again.

Yellow_Festiva · 02-02-2011, 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dannyhilton

http://www.fairtrading.qld.gov.au/ca...-consumers.htm

Think your cooling off period has been and gone. But as others have said, before thinking about canning the order, check with the sales staff member who sold you the car. If those talks don't progress to your liking, ask for your despot back. Hopefully talks will iron out any confusion, but if so don't hesitate to jump about. As with any deal, it's so important to get it in writing.

Good luck, and hopefully you end up getting what's yours, that LV Focus in the condition you agreed to!

The deal is well and truly done. The car is in my brothers garage (driven straight from dealer) as it is a surprise birthday present for my wife.

Shhhhhhhhhh!

Will watch out for what else is suggested and see what happens.

chrisfpv · 02-02-2011, 06:40 PM

I wouldn't have taken delivery of the car unless everything that was agreed upon prior to the deposit was done. But seeing as we're past that stage, go back to the dealership and talk to the dealer you originally made the deal with and speak with him.

Stay firm and let him know you're not happy and you're willing to take the issue to the top if he can't help you, even if you're not.

MAV50L · 02-02-2011, 06:40 PM

If you didnt get all the extras in writing you are well and truly screwed.
With used car salespeople never trust a word they say and get any promises in writing on the order docket as a condition of sale.
Otherwise they will quite happily promise you the world and fail to deliver Tasmania.

Yellow_Festiva · 02-02-2011, 06:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAV50L

If you didnt get all the extras in writing you are well and truly screwed.
With used car salespeople never trust a word they say and get any promises in writing on the order docket as a condition of sale.
Otherwise they will quite happily promise you the world and fail to deliver Tasmania.

Isn't hindsight a wonderful thing. I honestly thought I wouldn't need to go down that path seeing as I was dealing with an established and well known dealership.

It is such a shame. I was ready to get on here and praise the dealership prior to this happening but unfortunately It seems the stigma associated with car salespersons seems to run true.....

Glen 5150 · 02-02-2011, 06:49 PM

Don't like your chances mate, but a good lesson here is to always sign what they call in the industry is a "wish list". All things promised, mentioned, sweeteners are all on paper during negotiations and then you have a leg to stand on if they are not delivered.

My suggestion is to confront the Dealer in a calm manner and go from there, and maybe suggest you had intended having the car serviced there for its life? Unfortunately, the odds are against you but just remember ''the squeaky wheel always gets the oil". Give em hell mate, honestly, what have you got to lose?

stang65 · 02-02-2011, 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XR

I wouldn't have taken delivery of the car unless everything that was agreed upon prior to the deposit was done. But seeing as we're past that stage, go back to the dealership and talk to the dealer you originally made the deal with and speak with him.

Stay firm and let him know you're not happy and you're willing to take the issue to the top if he can't help you, even if you're not.

As above when you pick up a car if all is not as you agreed,do not drive it home.
Leave it with the dealer with instructions stating that you will pick it up when everything has been rectified. Or they put in writing what will be fixed or you will walk.

I hope it all works out but please learn from this mistake and make others aware if you or they end up in another similar situation.

04redxr8 · 02-02-2011, 07:12 PM

Can you atleast tell us what these extras were?

Danny · 02-02-2011, 07:30 PM

Mate as said before, and i have only just purchased a new car a week ago, so take it from my experience.

When you negotiate for a car, ALL EXTRAS that you have bargained in NEED to be written down on the contract of sale so you have proof of what was promised as a condition of sale.

If you sign the contract WITHOUT these extras on it, then you never had them... And you never will. Sorry, Harsh but true.

It's their job to be nice and friendly and act like a mate so that you won't want to get assertive with them, but once they have your signature, time for you to just become another sales quota, and off they are to the next punter...

-Dan

Yellow_Festiva · 02-02-2011, 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stang65

As above when you pick up a car if all is not as you agreed,do not drive it home.
Leave it with the dealer with instructions stating that you will pick it up when everything has been rectified. Or they put in writing what will be fixed or you will walk.

I hope it all works out but please learn from this mistake and make others aware if you or they end up in another similar situation.

The ironic thing is, I bought my first new car 11 years ago from Ford and got it serviced there until I was stuffed around. I vowed to never set foot in another Ford dealer again.

Now this happens. If it doesn't get resolved in a manner that pleases both parties there will not be a 3rd time and boy will I let others know about it.

I'm typing my letter now, already over a page and only 1/3rd of the issues have been mentioned. The more I type the more I am hell bent on taking this as far as necessary.

Right or wrong, written or verbal, blatant lying should not be the accepted norm of buying a car and even if I achieve nothing that benefits myself I will know that I gave it a shot and may have ruffled a few feathers in the process.

XD 351 Ute · 02-02-2011, 08:34 PM

Sorry to hear of your troubles Yellow, but I had ONE WORD cost me $500.00 when looking to purchase a second hand vehicle from our local ford dealer.

To cut long story short, I had the words 'subject to mechanical inspection' written on the contract, and after inspecting & driving the vehicle I realised it was a dud. Yes, I know I signed before seeing the car, but was sucked in by dealer spin, etc, etc.

Thinking that the above words would save my backside if anything went wrong, I thought I was safe.
The vehicle was presented with a 'road worthy' certificate, but was a complete piece of junk.
I had to get a solicitor to have to contract torn up, and I lost my $500.00.....

If I had had the words 'subject to PERSONAL inspection' (ie, me), I would have been fine.

As they say, buyer beware........

Ed

Dr Smith · 02-02-2011, 08:46 PM

If you bought a car from the second hand car yard of a Ford dealership then I can't see how Ford Motor Company Aust. has any obligation or involvement in your purchase. Sure, take it up with the original salesperson and his boss or the dealer principal.

Am I right in saying you inspected the car, made requests that were only verbally discussed, left a deposit and then came back the next day, paid the balance in full and took home your Fiesta. Did you mention anything at the time of pick up? I think you need to give us some specifics, eg you mention

Quote:

but in a watered down manner not reflecting the original discussions

, not sure what that means. If you asked for options and they were not the supplied in same brand/specs etc, but rather a cheaper/inferior product then fair enough I'd be complaining as well. Help us by giving some details please.

ZA-289 · 02-02-2011, 09:13 PM

Whenever I have bought cars from a Dealer I make sure everything I want done is written on the contract. They dont like it too much when you start writing more things on the contract yourself before you sign it....

**Silver Ghia** · 02-02-2011, 09:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZA-289

Whenever I have bought cars from a Dealer I make sure everything I want done is written on the contract. They dont like it too much when you start writing more things on the contract yourself before you sign it....

Then you need to check the car on delivery before handing any money or cheque over, to make sure the car is equipped with all those things the way you expected them, plus the car is to your satisfaction, no scratches, dents cleanliness etc. Even a test drive.

Once they have the money, the deal is virtually done.

jixel 78 · 02-02-2011, 09:43 PM

How much cheaper was it than a new one? As someone of obvious savvy with cars(being an AFF member) why is it that youre unhappy? 9000 kms isnt new now is it? Wandering into a Ford Dealer as somebody with an axe to grind already after a bad experience in the past, on top of being an individual obviously aware of the peaks and troughs of a fickle industry it strikes me as odd that you would buy a scratched, un-optioned demonstrator Focus from a dealer with verbal, unsigned un written agreements, and then go hell-for-leather at the dealer on a forum such as this? Stinks to high heaven. Again. Yawn.

Yellow_Festiva · 02-02-2011, 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Smith

If you bought a car from the second hand car yard of a Ford dealership then I can't see how Ford Motor Company Aust. has any obligation or involvement in your purchase. Sure, take it up with the original salesperson and his boss or the dealer principal.

Am I right in saying you inspected the car, made requests that were only verbally discussed, left a deposit and then came back the next day, paid the balance in full and took home your Fiesta. Did you mention anything at the time of pick up? I think you need to give us some specifics, eg you mention , not sure what that means. If you asked for options and they were not the supplied in same brand/specs etc, but rather a cheaper/inferior product then fair enough I'd be complaining as well. Help us by giving some details please.

Yes and no.

Looked at car late last week, discussed a few things, agreed on price based on these discussions, paid the deposit then returned yesterday to collect the car.

Ok, you are not the first to ask for specifics so this is the basis of my issues:

* It was promised that the car would be washed / detailed, several small paint chips be touched up and a few minor interior items be fixed.

Upon collection it was in the exact same condition as it was the week before bar the interior items. Only now there was a gouge on the top of the bumper measuring 4-5mm wide and around 30mm long. This was poorly touched up. Dealer assures me I can return the car in a week to get it professionally repaired.

* Extended 'Ford backed' warranty was included. I asked for specifics of warranty. They were that I could take it to ANY approved service centre, and that the warranty was good at any Ford.

Upon collection, the extended warranty was a dealer specific warranty with T&C that stated only the selling dealership could service the car (EVERY 5,000km or 3 months!), and that any warranty claims needed to go through the selling dealership ONLY. I questioned the ridiculousness of getting it serviced so regularly and he agreed and crossed out the 3 month / 5000km bit and said that 6 months / 10,000km 'would be fine'.

* I asked for some factory options (all new factory options were available to me according to them) so I got reverse sensors as part of the deal. They came back and said the 'cost price' I got didn't include painting, and that colour matching was $100 more. Fine, have your $100.

The sensors are a lighter shade. Didn't notice till I got home as they had parked the car facing the sun.

* The log book was empty of all servicing stamps. I questioned this and the guy assured me that all Ford owned cars are serviced correctly. The sales person also assured me that every car on the lot is serviced just prior to it being up for sale. I was told the log book would show this and I would be good for another 12 months or 15,000km after purchase.

Log book was not stamped on collection. After a bit of pushing it was stamped as being done several months back, with 2-3000km under the reading it had on the sale.

* I asked regarding servicing costs. The sales person asked and got back to me with '$199 fixed price' minor servicing 'Service A'. He said that would give me 'piece of mind' for the next few years. I asked for this in writing and he assured me that it will be part of the documentation in the sale.

Upon collection no paperwork regarding fixed servicing, and that 'the price was actually a little more. But this could not be determined as it depends on the state of the car'. When I question this he said no such price could ever have been given and that I would be paying more than $199 as a Diesel needs premium products. After a few phone calls I was told 'I should be able to get one done for low-mid 200's'.

Why did I take the car.... I had my mum collect me from work and take me to the dealership. She lives over an hr out of Sydney and I didn't want to make her feel like I was wasting her time.

Looking back over all your comments, I now realise how stupid I was to take the word of a salesperson at face value. You live and learn, as they say.

I will have a chat with the dealer and the salesperson. It will be calm and I will probably get nowhere. If that is the case I will then make a bit more of a Hoo haa with Ford and see where that gets me.

In all honesty, I'm more angry that they can so blatantly lie to someone rather than be up-front about things. I would have still got the car regardless of the extra warranty / fixed servicing etc

Worst case scenario, they don't give me anything promised, I tear up the extra warranty and get it serviced anywhere according to the logbooks and enjoy the last 2 years of real factory warranty and fix the colour of the sensors and the small scratch if I can be bothered.

In the end of the day, I got an almost new new car for $10 grand less than RRP, it is the colour the Mrs wants, still has the 'new car smell' and will be a fine (and safe!) chariot for our kids if we are blessed with some in the next year or 2.

Cheers for all your comments. Much appreciated.

Jason

Danny · 02-02-2011, 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jixel 78

How much cheaper was it than a new one? As someone of obvious savvy with cars(being an AFF member) why is it that youre unhappy? 9000 kms isnt new now is it? Wandering into a Ford Dealer as somebody with an axe to grind already after a bad experience in the past, on top of being an individual obviously aware of the peaks and troughs of a fickle industry it strikes me as odd that you would buy a scratched, un-optioned demonstrator Focus from a dealer with verbal, unsigned un written agreements, and then go hell-for-leather at the dealer on a forum such as this? Stinks to high heaven. Again. Yawn.

I have to say, stangely I agree with you.

Yellow Festiiva, you strike me as a little maybe (dare I say it) non confrontational?

I think you really need to stand up for yourself here buddy, 'stead of getting your anger out here..

Yellow_Festiva · 02-02-2011, 10:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jixel 78

How much cheaper was it than a new one? As someone of obvious savvy with cars(being an AFF member) why is it that youre unhappy? 9000 kms isnt new now is it? Wandering into a Ford Dealer as somebody with an axe to grind already after a bad experience in the past, on top of being an individual obviously aware of the peaks and troughs of a fickle industry it strikes me as odd that you would buy a scratched, un-optioned demonstrator Focus from a dealer with verbal, unsigned un written agreements, and then go hell-for-leather at the dealer on a forum such as this? Stinks to high heaven. Again. Yawn.

Thank you for your input. Some of your answers can be found in my above post.

Of course 9,000km isn't new. I didn't claim it was. I certainly went into the dealer with no 'axe to grind'.. I tend to forgive and forget rather fast to be honest. As stated, I'm more annoyed with the manner in which they deal with customers. In the end of the day, I'm not all that worse off, and I got the car I wanted.

I went 'hell for leather?' Geeze, was I really that bad??

Cheers,

Jason

Yellow_Festiva · 02-02-2011, 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danny

I have to say, stangely I agree with you.

Yellow Festiiva, you strike me as a little maybe (dare I say it) non confrontational?

I think you really need to stand up for yourself here buddy, 'stead of getting your anger out here..

Mate I hear you. And you would be correct. I come from a family where confrontation is the norm. Had another that shares my last name be in my situation the guy would not be in a good state.

I'm work in an industry where regular police checks and a clean record is a must. I need to be very careful with how I interact with people, believe me, I wanted to jump up and down on this mongrels head and really 'show him' but in the end of the day, it will achieve nothing positive. I will go home to my beautiful wife, go back to normal and be content with what I have.

The other guy will go to work and lie through his teeth to earn his money.

I also believe in Karma. He will cross someone who sorts out his anger by flattening the person.

Cheers

Brazen · 02-02-2011, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yellow_Festiva

Thank you for your input. Some of your answers can be found in my above post.

Of course 9,000km isn't new. I didn't claim it was. I certainly went into the dealer with no 'axe to grind'.. I tend to forgive and forget rather fast to be honest. As stated, I'm more annoyed with the manner in which they deal with customers. In the end of the day, I'm not all that worse off, and I got the car I wanted.

I went 'hell for leather?' Geeze, was I really that bad??

Cheers,

Jason

I actually totally appreciate your feelings on this. Im sure if you showed up and the only thing wrong was the car wasnt washed you would probably accept it as it might have been one of those tasks which slipped through the cracks in a busy dealership.

However the problems you have arnt the result of a communication problem they are the result of basically being mislead. Being told a fixed price service cost when it dosnt exist must have put you off. Then to be told that the warranty which is valid when serviced ANYWHERE is a lie.. and 'ford backed'? what a load of crap. You also had the extra $100 fee to match the sensors (??).

The problems you have arnt honest mistakes, you have been lied to to get your signature. Honestly in the end, your car isnt really worse off for the problems so you will still love the car, but how you were treated must really sting.

04redxr8 · 02-02-2011, 10:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yellow_Festiva

Yes and no.

Looked at car late last week, discussed a few things, agreed on price based on these discussions, paid the deposit then returned yesterday to collect the car.

Ok, you are not the first to ask for specifics so this is the basis of my issues:

* It was promised that the car would be washed / detailed, several small paint chips be touched up and a few minor interior items be fixed.

Upon collection it was in the exact same condition as it was the week before bar the interior items. Only now there was a gouge on the top of the bumper measuring 4-5mm wide and around 30mm long. This was poorly touched up. Dealer assures me I can return the car in a week to get it professionally repaired.

That is a pretty poor way of delivering a vehicle, new or secondhand. I'm sure if you took it to the salesman, he shuld be able to organise a detail for you.

* Extended 'Ford backed' warranty was included. I asked for specifics of warranty. They were that I could take it to ANY approved service centre, and that the warranty was good at any Ford.

Upon collection, the extended warranty was a dealer specific warranty with T&C that stated only the selling dealership could service the car (EVERY 5,000km or 3 months!), and that any warranty claims needed to go through the selling dealership ONLY. I questioned the ridiculousness of getting it serviced so regularly and he agreed and crossed out the 3 month / 5000km bit and said that 6 months / 10,000km 'would be fine'.

You should still have the remaining manufacturers new car warranty. Most aftermarket warrantys are not worth the paper they are printed on.

* I asked for some factory options (all new factory options were available to me according to them) so I got reverse sensors as part of the deal. They came back and said the 'cost price' I got didn't include painting, and that colour matching was $100 more. Fine, have your $100.

The sensors are a lighter shade. Didn't notice till I got home as they had parked the car facing the sun.

They should be able to fix that easily. After all, you paid for it.

* The log book was empty of all servicing stamps. I questioned this and the guy assured me that all Ford owned cars are serviced correctly. The sales person also assured me that every car on the lot is serviced just prior to it being up for sale. I was told the log book would show this and I would be good for another 12 months or 15,000km after purchase.

Log book was not stamped on collection. After a bit of pushing it was stamped as being done several months back, with 2-3000km under the reading it had on the sale.

This completely contradicts the warranty T&C's. Not to mention makes me question the legalities of it. If the Service Log book, can be used to determine the quality of the car, that is now misleading. It also falsey states that at that particular date, that car had those particular km's on it. I would ask for prove that the service actually took place.

* I asked regarding servicing costs. The sales person asked and got back to me with '$199 fixed price' minor servicing 'Service A'. He said that would give me 'piece of mind' for the next few years. I asked for this in writing and he assured me that it will be part of the documentation in the sale.

Upon collection no paperwork regarding fixed servicing, and that 'the price was actually a little more. But this could not be determined as it depends on the state of the car'. When I question this he said no such price could ever have been given and that I would be paying more than $199 as a Diesel needs premium products. After a few phone calls I was told 'I should be able to get one done for low-mid 200's'.

That could be more a pain. Servicing to a price rather than a standard. I wouldn't pursue that one. Just go elsewhere.

Why did I take the car.... I had my mum collect me from work and take me to the dealership. She lives over an hr out of Sydney and I didn't want to make her feel like I was wasting her time.

Looking back over all your comments, I now realise how stupid I was to take the word of a salesperson at face value. You live and learn, as they say.

I will have a chat with the dealer and the salesperson. It will be calm and I will probably get nowhere. If that is the case I will then make a bit more of a Hoo haa with Ford and see where that gets me.

In all honesty, I'm more angry that they can so blatantly lie to someone rather than be up-front about things. I would have still got the car regardless of the extra warranty / fixed servicing etc

Worst case scenario, they don't give me anything promised, I tear up the extra warranty and get it serviced anywhere according to the logbooks and enjoy the last 2 years of real factory warranty and fix the colour of the sensors and the small scratch if I can be bothered.

In the end of the day, I got an almost new new car for $10 grand less than RRP, it is the colour the Mrs wants, still has the 'new car smell' and will be a fine (and safe!) chariot for our kids if we are blessed with some in the next year or 2.

Cheers for all your comments. Much appreciated.

Jason

Good luck, and I hope you get to actually enjoy the car once these things are sorted.

b0son · 03-02-2011, 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yellow_Festiva

Isn't hindsight a wonderful thing.

Hindsight, or common sense? You're dealing with salespeople - of course you get it in writing.

martyal44 · 03-02-2011, 09:54 AM

I'm sorry for your 'run around' on this. The forums are a good distillation for these issues and you're right about watching your attitude in these situations.
You should have had better service from a dealer, esp a Ford dealer who would be concerned about their reputation and a considered approach with the original sales
person and managers with as much in writing as possible is the way to go. And as it's a present for your wife it must be harder. Good luck with it all and don't be unwilling to name the dealer or initials of the sales guy; myself and 100s of other forum users don't want a time wasting runaround or to be ripped off.

FG XR · 03-02-2011, 10:22 AM

Good luck and hope you can resolve this but in the end because most of it was verbal they will / can more than likely get away with it. Wife had this happen to her years ago, she was promised floorm mats and a dash mat however upon pickup of her new demo car none of the above was there, we questioned it but the salesman had oviously changed his mind or was not allowed to give these items away.